Five Reasons Why Florida Might Be The Best State To Seek Out And Achieve Early Retirement

beachsideI was working for a domestic car dealership just outside metro Detroit in early 2009. Couldn’t have picked a worse career at a worse time in a worse place.

I remember there were fears over the manufacturer possibly going out of business. People stopped buying cars. The service lane became a lot less busy. And people were getting fired. Including yours truly.

So a few months later, I packed my bags for greener (literally!) pastures and moved to Southwest Florida to start my life anew. That turned out to be one of the best decisions I’ve ever made.

But let’s back it up a bit.

Why Florida? I could have moved anywhere in the country at the time. I moved down here after finding a cheap room for rent on craigslist, but without a job in hand. So Florida was just as good as anywhere else. Right?

Well, maybe not.

I did a ton of research on different cities and states across the country and, after spending weeks with this, determined that Florida was the best place to start over, begin a new lifestyle, and flourish.

Now, some of the reasons I picked Southwest Florida are individualistic and qualitative. Where you live isn’t (and really shouldn’t be) all about money. If we all wanted to just live where it was cheapest, we’d all be living in Detroit or somewhere similar. But I’m going to do my best to narrow this down to five fairly objective reasons that anyone looking to chase after and achieve early retirement ought to at least consider Florida, and specifically Southwest Florida (my general experience and this article tilts toward the Tampa Bay area).

You’re Surrounded By People That Retired At A Normal Age

I hope this doesn’t come across as condescending, because that’s not my intention.

Florida is a popular retirement destination in general, largely due to the reasons I’m going to list in this article. And living in a county where, as of 2010, over 30% of the population is over the age of 65, I see a lot of people that retired at a more traditional age and are just now living life on their terms. But I also see a lot of people on an everyday basis that are physically and mentally in decline. This isn’t hyperbole. I write at a coffee shop within walking distance to our apartment and older people that have a hard time hearing/walking/communicating come in here frequently.

Well, I never wanted to be one of those people. I mean, look, we all become old one day, if we’re so fortunate enough to live a long, happy, healthy life. But who wants to wait until their capabilities are starting to dwindle to finally own their time, set their own schedule, and enjoy the best luxuries that are known to man?

I remember telling people when I first moved down here that I always wanted to spend more time around palm trees, beautiful sunsets, sandy beaches, and sunshine. Coming from Michigan, only some of those things were available, and certainly not in the quantity or quality that Florida offers. But I would also tell people that I didn’t want to wait until I was an old man to enjoy those things. Why suffer through 30 more years of brutal Michigan winters just to finally enjoy sunshine, palm trees, and beaches? Why wait? Why retire and move to Florida when I’m 60 or 70 years old? Why not enjoy my life now? Moreover, why wait so long to retire?

Well, I know of no better motivation than to see the alternative on a regular basis. I get to see firsthand what “real” retirement looks like – finally enjoying life when you’re used up and burned out. Sorry, but no. That’s not for me. Seeing what might happen if I don’t live below my means and invest intelligently so that I can buy my time about 30 years faster than most is all the motivation I need to keep going.

Fantastic Weather

Sure, it gets hot in the summertime down here. But Florida’s “brutal” summers are overrated, and this is coming from someone who has experienced both Midwest summers and the worst Florida has to offer. The truth of the matter is this: It’s hot everywhere in the summer. As I type this article, it’s 81 degrees here in Sarasota. It’s 80 degrees in Washington D.C. It’s 85 degrees in Chicago. It’s 85 degrees in St. Louis (with the same humidity there as we have here right now). Meanwhile, it’s 105 degrees in Phoenix.

And, yes, the humidity is high in the summer. But, according to The Weather Channel, it “feels like” 85 in Chicago right now and it “feels like” 86 here in Sarasota at the same exact time. Think that’s just today? It’s supposed to be 97 degrees in St. Louis tomorrow – about 13 degrees warmer than what we’re expecting down here in “brutal” Florida.

I can say from personal experience the biggest difference between summers down here and what I used to experience back in the Midwest are threefold: it’s consistently hot for about four months straight, it stays hot even at night, and it rains in the afternoon (although, it generally quickly stops) far more often. But that’s really about it.

However, we more than make up for that with about eight months of glorious weather. The difference between Florida and most of the rest of the country during the summer might be a few degrees of “feels like” weather. But the difference between Florida and the rest of the country in the middle of say, January, is quite stark. Like 30 or 40 degrees stark. Try weather in the mid-70s to the low 80s with little rain (and lower humidity) for about eight months straight (including in the middle of winter), more or less.

What does that mean for us freedom fighters? 

Well, it means you can live without a car fairly easily for the entire year. I’ve waited for the bus in the middle of an Ann Arbor, Michigan winter and that wasn’t fun. 20 degrees and snow up past my ankles. No, thanks.

Conversely, it’s a lot easier to wait for the bus when it’s sunny, the sky is blue, and it’s a comfortable temperature outside. Same goes for walking or biking. This makes it relatively painless to live without a car while simultaneously still maintaining your quality of life. I’ve also owned a few 49cc scooters down here as well. Easy and cheap to scoot around town, and you don’t need to garage it for six months per year.

And the weather also makes it easy to enjoy the outdoors all year long. One of the main advantages of being financially independent is that you own your own time, able to set your own schedule at will. You’re able to do what you want, when you want, and with whom you want. But that might not be such an advantage if it’s freezing outside and there’s six inches of snow on the ground (maybe you’re really into snowboarding, though). However, you can maximize an open schedule all year down here. Doesn’t matter if it’s January or July.

One last point is that we spend very little on utilities here. The most comfortable temperature for the human body is 72 degrees. Well, we spend a good portion of the year in that temperature range down here, minimizing the need for air conditioning (and we almost never turn on the furnace). A fan while you sleep is about as much you need for maybe five or six months, if that. We’ll use the air conditioning for a good four or five months per year, but even then it’s not pumping all the time. Not that difficult to cool it down to 77 degrees or so, even in the summer. Especially when living in an apartment where neighbors in adjoining units are keeping their apartments even cooler. Economies of scale, and I’m happy to suck up a little bit of their air conditioning.

No State Income Tax

This is a huge advantage to living here and one of the key reasons I moved here in the first place.

I pay zilch to the state of Florida in the form of state income tax. How amazing is that?

Well, imagine you’re earning $40,000 per year in dividend income. And let’s say you have a state that collects 6% of that (not totally uncommon). That’s $200 per month that you could otherwise use to pay for… well… anything. $200 per month is a lot of money. That currently covers my mobile phone, utilities, and even a few meals.

But here in Florida I keep everything I make from the perspective of state income tax. And I’ve already discussed before why dividend income is so attractive from the perspective of federal income taxation. Living in Florida means you might actually pay zero income tax on your dividend income, depending on your bracket. Death and taxes? Maybe we can knock one of the two out. I’ll see what I can come up with one on the other one.

Now, some like to point to state income tax and say there’s no free lunch – you’ll pay your fair share somehow. I’m not so sure about that.

For instance, I’ve always wanted to try out living in the Pacific Northwest, especially Portland (it was a place I considered back in 2009). Seems like an amazing city. Maybe I’ll even still live there one day. But Oregon has a state income tax that tops out at 9.9%. Even if you don’t earn a lot of money, you’ll still be sending in a hefty check since those making just a little more than $8,000 per year are already exposed to the 9% bracket.

Those who live over there are quick to point out there’s no sales tax in Oregon. Big whoop. If you’re living frugally enough to put yourself in this kind of a position in the first place, you’re likely not consuming much anyway. And I tend to find that groceries is always one of the biggest categories in my monthly budget that could possibly be exposed to sales tax, yet Florida doesn’t tax groceries.

Property taxes? I’ve never seen anything that shows that a piece of real estate in the Tampa Bay area of Florida has a higher property tax rate than that of similar real estate in a comparably large city in high-tax states like California, Oregon, or Hawaii. In fact, property in those states tends to be more expensive in general, so even a lower rate would still likely lead to a higher absolute bill, if we’re comparing apples to apples. But I don’t own, so property taxes is a moot point. However, I do find that rent here is similar (or less) to what I’d pay in comparable cities in states where income tax is present at all (along with a similar lifestyle), and certainly in states where the income tax is relatively high.

You can control your expenses to a degree. But if you owe the state a check, it is what it is. I find it preferable to live where I can rent an affordable apartment, not pay taxes on that which I consume the most, and not pay taxes on my income. If you can keep 100% of your dividend income and not have to pay the federal or state government a penny, that’s a pretty amazing position to be in.

I’ll quickly note, to be fair, that you might be able to land a job in a high-tax state that pays a high enough income to offset those higher taxes and expenses. But car dealerships didn’t pay a substantially higher income in other areas of the country (I looked), and definitely not enough to offset the higher expenses and taxes. The income didn’t scale well, so I took advantage of geographical arbitrage and moved to a place where I could create a large gap between income and expenses, and no state income tax helped dramatically toward that endeavor.

Nature’s Best

Mountains are beautiful. Don’t get me wrong. But I think there’s also something pretty magical about the coast. And you have access to the second-largest coastline in the US here in Florida, at over 1,300 miles.

Beautiful beaches like Siesta Key – it’s won numerous awards for “best beach” by various publications – dot the Southwestern coastline of Florida where you can literally walk right up to the beach, plop yourself down, and gaze out in amazement. Or play football. Or volleyball. Or sleep. Or jog. Or walk. Or do pretty much anything. Anything is better at the beach. I even sometimes think about rigging up a way to write out there occasionally. Wouldn’t that be something?

But what’s really fantastic about all the beaches and parks we have down here is that you can enjoy them for free and all year long. How frugally fantastic. It’s completely free to grab a towel and hit the beach for a few hours. Watch the sun set over the horizon and celebrate another day being alive. I can surely think of more expensive ways to spend an afternoon, and those more expensive ways probably won’t even be as much fun.

I remember when I first moved down here, I would spend hours at the beach. And I’d always tell people how amazing the beaches were. Imagine my surprise when they’d tell me that they rarely visited. They were too busy – surprise, surprise – working.

Affordable Cost Of Living

You think you’d have to pay a ton of money to live in a veritable paradise where the weather is gorgeous for eight months per year (and really not all that bad for the other four), you have access to beautiful beaches, there’s no state income tax, and the motivation to retire early is in your face all the time.

But it’s just not so.

We pay $925 per month for our two-bedroom condo. I haven’t looked at the specs in some time now, but it’s over 900 square feet. It’s a few miles away from the ocean. It’s located near multiple bus lines. We can walk to multiple stores, a grocery store, entertainment options, restaurants, and various businesses like the local veterinarian.

Groceries are similar to any other place. Gas as well. So is pretty much everything else. But you’ll be spending most of your money on housing, and I find housing (especially rent) in this area of Florida to be fairly cost effective for what you get in terms of actual housing and the lifestyle around that housing.

This lifestyle in many parts of the country is much more expensive. I know because I’ve looked. And it’s certainly more expensive in areas with comparable weather, like Southern California or Hawaii. I think the only other state that’s really comparable across the board is Texas. You’ve got no state income tax, pretty nice weather for much of the year (though, I understand it can get a lot hotter in the summer in many parts of the state), and comparable cost of living. But that state doesn’t have amazing beaches like we have here in Florida.

Conclusion

There are expensive areas of Florida, like Miami. However, those areas are easily avoided. Meanwhile, the Tampa Bay area of Florida offers a lot to like. You get a lot of the amenities that any other big city might offer, but at very affordable prices. The weather is absolutely amazing for most of the year, you’re not taxed by the state on any money you make, the beaches are nothing short of spectacular, and you’re encouraged to retire early by the very nature of the populace. If seeing someone in their 70s or 80s struggling to complete regular tasks like walking isn’t enough to motivate you to think about your future self, I don’t know what is.

If you’re looking to maximize your chances retiring early/becoming financially independent early in life, and then also maximize your life after you get there, the Tampa Bay area of Florida is one of the best options I know of.

I’m not saying Florida is the best state to live in. I’m not even saying I’ll always live here. But I think for intents and purposes of seeking out and achieving early retirement, Florida offers the right mix of benefits to make the journey and destination easier and more enjoyable, in my view.

And if I had to do 2009 all over again, there’s nowhere else I would have moved to. The income taxes I’ve saved over the last six years alone surely adds up to a tidy sum, and I’m very happy about that. More in my pocket and less in the state’s. In addition, I received a hefty pay raise (relative to what I was making in Michigan) once I landed a job down here. So I was saving money on my general cost of living as well as the 4%+ the state of Michigan charges for state income tax while simultaneously making more money and having more opportunities to save money. That growing delta between income and expenses helped get me to where I’m at now, and I’ll always be thankful for that.

What do you think? Is Florida a great place to seek out and achieve early retirement? Where do you think is best? 

Thanks for reading.

Photo Credit: samarttiw/FreeDigitalPhotos.net

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193 Comments

  1. I think the big drawback in Florida is the high crime rate and lack of culture. I know you haven’t experienced that, but it’s a real concern for a lot of people. Otherwise, I completely agree with you. I’m hoping to take a vacation to the St. Petersburg/Sarasota area at some point in the next few years.

  2. EWB,

    I’m not sure high crime and lack of culture is really accurate. Depends on where you live, just like with any other state. And depends on what you mean by “culture”. Obviously, the Hispanic/Cuban culture is pretty rich here, especially in Miami. The arts are also pretty well represented in most major cities. But, yeah, if you’re living in the middle of a small town near the Everglades, culture will probably be minimal. Just like if you’re living in a tiny suburb in the middle of Oklahoma.

    As far as crime, I’m not sure that’s accurate, either. I looked really heavily at Portland years ago, and I just love the look of that city. If I were to ever move again, Portland is the near the top of my list. But if you look at the FBI stats, they favor Tampa. Neighborhoodscout gives Tampa a score of 21 and Portland a score of 6 (the higher, the better):

    http://www.neighborhoodscout.com/or/portland/crime/

    http://www.neighborhoodscout.com/fl/tampa/crime/

    That’s using FBI stats. So Portland is technically less safe, just averaging it out across the board. But that really comes down to the neighborhood. Live in a high-crime neighborhood, and the odds aren’t on your side. But I’ve found that one can generally avoid being a victim by just making smart decisions. And that comes from someone who grew up in a nasty part of Detroit.

    St. Pete has a great downtown and fantastic beaches. The area between the two is a bit rough in some areas, though.

    Thanks for stopping by!

    Cheers.

  3. Der Investor,

    Thanks so much. Appreciate you stopping by from Austria. It’s wonderful to have fans/readers from all over the world.

    I’ll keep writing if you keep reading. 🙂

    Take care!

  4. This is a large part of the reason why my parents finally settled down after spending 13 years living full time in an RV in Jacksonville, FL. Though they hate the heat and humidity, they quite enjoy the water, the weather (during the other three seasons), and the lack of a state income tax. 🙂

    I can see myself eventually settling down somewhere in Florida…maybe the Gulf side, around Tampa, on the water.

  5. Steve,

    Glad they’re enjoying life over in Jacksonville. 🙂

    Florida has drawbacks, just like anywhere else. But the benefits outweigh the drawbacks, in my opinion, for those trying to live a lifestyle congruent with achieving early financial independence/retirement.

    I’ve considered the rest of the state, but I definitely think the Gulf area around Tampa Bay makes the most sense. Just depends on what you want. But you get a little bit of everything around this area.

    Thanks for stopping by!

    Best wishes.

  6. Hi Jason

    thanks for opening your choice up a little! I am sure that just the beaches are more than reason enough to justify your move, never mind tax and other.

    I have done 3 international moves so far (Germany->Finland->UK->Finland) and none for tax/retirement reasons. But I learned, that you end up having essentially 3 choices: 1. stay where you are, 2. go back to where you came and 3. go somewhere new. I also observed that such moves tend to take up a lot of energy, as well as establishing one self in the new (also old new) place. Sometimes you see it as fun and it is an easy move, but sometimes it can also be tough going. I guess that the older you get, the more one will notice the effort it takes, particularly when in ordinary retirement age.

    Do I understand correctly that you still have to pay federal tax on your dividends? So of $100 dividend you are not taking $100 home, right?

    As my wife and I will probably not put up with the Finnish winter all the way, I have Florida as a firm candidate on my list of retirement locations, but I fear this would not be any time soon.

    Philipp

  7. I really enjoyed your analysis of the Tampa bay area. Mr. Crackin’ and I have talked extensively about “moving to the beach”. We know it’s not going to happen real soon though. My parents are older and in bad health, and I’m an only child. We don’t plan on being here forever though, maybe 10 more years. We look forward to a warmer climate year round and outdoor living!

  8. Philipp,

    I’m really fortunate. It’s one thing to scout a place out and come up with reasons on paper as to why it should work out. It’s quite another thing to execute all of that and see it through.

    I definitely agree with you that moving/trying out new places becomes more burdensome as you get older. That’s something I’ve touched on before, which is one of the reasons I think it’s so important to own your own time and seek out adventures while you’re still young.

    As far as your question on taxes goes, one pays $0 in federal taxes on qualified dividend income as long as they’re within the 15% tax bracket. That means you could potentially earn $40k/year (or even a little more) in qualified dividend income (assuming no active income) and pay zilch. That’s why living in a state with no income tax makes a lot of sense – limits your liability even further.

    I understand Finland can be pretty brutal during the winter with the lack of sunlight and cold temps. Similar to what we experience up north here in the US. I once read somewhere that Northern Europe is even worse with the lack of sunlight, though. That would probably bum me out a little. Hopefully, you guys can figure out a place that works for you down the road. 🙂

    Cheers!

  9. Mrs. Crackin’,

    Definitely tough to just up and move if you have obligations (especially related to family) where you’re currently at. If the opportunity ever presents itself, though, this area of Florida makes a lot of sense. You get a semi-tropical lifestyle at a very affordable price, relatively speaking. 🙂

    Thanks for dropping by!

    Best regards.

  10. Hey Jason,
    About a 5 years ago my bestfriend moved down to the Ft. Lauderdale area to persue law school. He’s done now and doesn’t want to return to NYC at all. He’s actually almost 100% against even visiting. Fast forward to last year my cousin, his inlaws, and his grand inlaws all left the NYC area for Florida as well. The taxes, stagnant wages, and general overcrowding of this area is what pushed them out.
    At least I have plenty of places to stay for free down there now. 😉
    Like EWB above maybe a trip out there in the coming years is in order.
    Cheers,
    Rich

  11. Rich,

    That’s really interesting. I certainly think there’s more to where you live than just costs, but one’s overall cost of living is obviously very important. That’s why I never even considered NYC. Glad your friends and family are happy in Florida. 🙂

    A free place to stay is pretty sweet. Maybe it’s serendipitous. You never know!

    Cheers.

  12. Texas isn’t bad but get ready for 100 plus summers and subpar beaches. If you try out Texas then Austin is probably your best bet, but I’d venture to say where you are at is better by default because of the obvious reasons you mentioned above.

  13. J.o.,

    I agree. 🙂

    I actually had a potential job opportunity down in Houston before I moved to Florida. But it appeared that I could make more here in Florida. Factoring in the cooler summers, warmer winters, access to beaches, and overall higher quality of life (in my opinion), this area of Florida won out pretty quickly. But I agree that Austin makes a lot of sense if you’re going to move to Texas, especially if you’re young and progressive. However, Austin is getting pretty expensive, from what I understand.

    Best regards!

  14. Jason,

    I can tell you that I have been dreaming of retiring to Florida since 1992. It is truly an amazing place. I will read up later and get back to you. The work is piled higher than I can describe right now, so no time for anything else. Good luck.

    Keep cranking,

    Robert the DividendDreamer
    AKA — Seeking Dividends

  15. I currently live in NYC which I think is a great place to live during my wealth accumulation years, not so much for FI/RE years. I’ve thought about moving to Florida before but it’s just so far away from friends and family. Maybe some day I’ll move into an RV and live in Florida during the winter and the Northeast during the summer 🙂

  16. Robert,

    As someone who dreamed of living here before moving here, I can say that it’s all it’s cracked up to be. It’s not perfect, but no place is. However, you get a semi-tropical lifestyle for a fraction of the money that other places with similar lifestyles and temperatures would cost. A lot of value down here for what you get, in my opinion. I’d pay far more to live here, but don’t tell anyone. 🙂

    Take care!

  17. FF,

    If you have a job that scales up through COLA or something, then living in big cities might make sense. Especially if you crave that lifestyle. My old career didn’t scale up, though. I could have had a job in Chicago back in 2009, but the income adjustment made no sense for me.

    But, hey, you can always vacation down here. The US is an amazing place where you can freely vacation/move to such disparate places. 🙂

    Cheers!

  18. My expenses have actually not increased (increased rent but no more car) from moving to NYC. Plus I now walk to work. But my income has increased at a decent clip to a level I could not have made where I was.

  19. Definitely some great points about Florida. For many of us, location is mostly driven by family/friends and our chosen career prospects and where that takes us. A difference of 5% in taxes one way or another is easily overshadowed by career potential and cost of living.

    I’m in a similar state as you. To some degree, you “pay the state” in some way, but there are places where that doesn’t fully hold up. But, I think for most, it’s really about family/friends/career. Personally, I would ideally like all of those to be in Florida, Texas, or Washington, but I realize that may not happen.

    I DO know for a fact that I want to at a minimum end up hopefully staying in places with at least a moderate cost of living… for me that just means not a super high cost of living like most of the northeast and the majority of California.

    In my field, there are tons of jobs in the biggest cities, but when thinking about the increase in pay I would need to justify the higher cost of living, it’s not very likely I’ll get enough of a premium to do that and also get a raise to move over. First world problems certainly.

    Hope you get a chance to try out a new place! Once you get closer to FI, it’s entirely possible to spend a few years trying out new cities. 10% tax? No big deal. It’s the cost of “travel”. Think of it as philanthropy to state govt’s. 🙂

  20. So you are saying you have an extra room for visitors right 😉

    That state income tax sucks to be honest. And think if you lived in a place like NYC – it is just highway robbery. No wonder retirees go to Florida.

    While certain income like business income (think 1099, LLC etc) is exempt from tax in my state, dividends are not ;-( This was one of the reasons I am pursuing tax-deferred accounts so aggressively.

    And on a side note, how is the weather like in say November – February? It is miserable in KS/MO…

  21. FF,

    Yeah, it’s all relative.

    I can’t imagine being able to replicate our lifestyle up in NYC anywhere close to what I pay down here. I’m already living car-free, so I wouldn’t save anything there. In fact, public transportation up there is significantly more expensive than it is down here. So living without a car would be more expensive. Plus, I’d be having to move around in fairly cold weather for a good portion of the year. And I’m guessing I’d be paying a lot more than $925/month for a similar apartment up there. I didn’t look into car dealerships in NYC, but the pay didn’t change much in Chicago, Houston, or Honolulu. And certainly not enough to offset the much higher taxes and overall expenses.

    Like I said, COLA goes a long way. That’s if you can get it. It didn’t work out for me like that. And I suspect it doesn’t work out for a lot of jobs. Just depends on what you do and what you’re willing to put up with for that experience.

    Cheers!

  22. Ravi,

    Agreed. Family pulls are quite strong for most people. I just realized that I’d be spending a lot more time in “my” life than any of my “family’s” lives, so I had to make sure I was fully happy with where I was at and what I was doing. Living down here gave me (and gives me) the best opportunity to be happy and move much closer to the long-term goals I had started to formulate at that time. And visiting is just a quick plane trip away. It worked out pretty well.

    I might move away from Florida at some point. If I lived somewhere more expensive (and possibly with a high state income tax), it would just be something I’d chalk up to being in a position of power where I was able to easily afford it. At some point, one doesn’t really need to worry about money anymore. Hope to be in such a fantastic position within the next decade or so. 🙂

    Thanks for sharing!

    Best regards.

  23. DGI,

    I hear you. Taxes, taxes, taxes. I suppose one reason I haven’t had to be particularly aggressive on tax-advantaged accounts is because of that favorable state income tax situation down here.

    The weather here from November to February is absolutely amazing. It’s similar to those “perfect” summer days, but it’s present pretty much every day. Generally, it’s in the mid-70s with low humidity, little cloud coverage, little rain. In other words, beautiful. 🙂

    Cheers!

  24. Hello Jason.

    Here in the south of Spain we have really “brutal” summers (more than 100 ºF) with humidity and mild winters with not a lot of rainy days.

    As far as you’ve described Florida’s weather, I suppose Florida is better than Murcia (Spain), where I live.

    I live in a town with my wife and we can walk to work without problems.

    Florida is better too on state taxes.

    I think you’re in the right place although southern spaniards tend to say “We live in the best place”. We were wrong, hahaha.

    Thanks you to describe your paradise.

  25. I love almost all of the reasons you shared to live in Florida. My wife is originally from there so she really wants to move back. She is from the Miami area so that’s most likely where we will end up. When we lived down there previously I enjoyed many of the things about FL, one of my drawbacks was finding work, which ultimately led to moving back to the Chicago area. However if I am FI option work makes things a lot easier to enjoy including beaches and the parks.

    Finding the right mix of cost of living in the Miami area could be the hardest part, it’s something to look forward to on our ride to FI.

  26. I like my current spot in Austin, Texas. As you said, we have no state income tax and good winter weather. We have really awesome springs, too, because Ladybird Johnson got people into wildflowers. Summer is crazy hot, but I can handle heat better than cold. And it’s a great time to leave town on vacation! It rarely snows, but sometimes does, and most people get the day off. It doesn’t rain much, but when it does, you know the plants are super happy. So basically, even our bad weather is good (except for the heat).

    I’m not into beaches or mountains–I’m most into forests (except for the mosquitos), but I’ve also grown to love scrub and desert. It is amazing what plants can grow in.

    We also don’t have much in the way of museums or sports, but we do have a big state university and a few other colleges as well. So library access is quite nice. I also like an open social culture, which is pretty dismal in my state, but I’m in one of the oases.

    Then there’s the socializing. It’s a lot easier living away from friends now that there’s an internet, but it’s still good to have some close by. Half my friends live here, and the rest are scattered (the #2 spot is a super-expensive part of California). My parents and brother live an easy day trip away (4 hours), though my sister is in Indiana. I’ve looked into Indiana–it’s culturally a lot more like Texas than I ever would have guessed! Plus cold. So it’s not my favorite even though my sister loves it because of the great Society for Creative Anachronism they have there. I did learn that Amtrak goes straight from Austin to Chicago, and then you can take a side trip to Indianapolis, so that’s handy!

    I’ve been looking for a back-up place to live in case things get too crazy corrupt here or we run out of water or turn into ocean or something. So far I’ve felt most comfortable in Oklahoma City. The streets make sense there. Some governor said he’d raise the sales tax 2 cents for 5 years for several projects, and at the end of the five years, they really did drop the tax, they really did have the projects complete, and at least the baseball stadium won some kind of award, so the projects weren’t all crappy.

    I’m also sort of from Chicago, but the winters are too brutal. I thought Burlington (Vermont) or Seattle might lure me in culturally, but no. In other countries, I’ve most liked The Netherlands (low corruption, good for not owning a car) and England (they’re so polite!) but the Netherlands is hard to get into and England is expensive.

    Fiinally, I love Tex Mex food and still haven’t figured out how to make it as well as my favorite restaurants. And I do love the wildflowers everywhere–almost makes up for having very subtle fall color.

    So currently my plan is to stay here, but also have enough money to travel once or twice a year to some of the other cool places.

  27. DR,

    Thanks for dropping by from Spain! 🙂

    Yeah, we don’t often see 100 degrees here, if ever. I think the all-time record for Tampa is 99 degrees.

    But one man’s paradise is another man’s nightmare. All relative. As long as you’re happy and healthy where you’re living, and on pace for your goals, that’s all that really matters.

    Best wishes!

  28. evensteven,

    Miami is definitely a beautiful area. Beautiful scenery and beautiful people. 🙂

    Just doing a quick Google search shows Chicago’s unemployment rate at 6.5% and Miami’s at 6%. So you might not have that much of a challenge finding work down in Miami, compared to Chicago. But that all depends on your particular position, obviously.

    Best of luck, either way. Chicago and Miami are both incredible cities. Been to both. Enjoyed both. Although, Chicago is way too cold, snowy, and windy for me in the winter.

    Cheers!

  29. You make a compelling case for Florida but I’ll stick with Texas for now. Although your weather and beaches sound awesome. I dont thing financial issues should be the only factor but they should playva role. No sense in making the best financial decisions if it means youre miserable in your day to day life. But I think you found a great balance between the two. Im sure when you look back that was one of the bestvdecisions of your life even if you had no idea of the significance it would have on your life or what road it would take you down.

  30. Debbie,

    Definitely. If I were to live in Texas, it’d be Austin. But it’s getting more expensive there, from what I’ve heard. Haven’t looked into it myself, but that would seem to be supported by just some quick numbers I’ve run across. I think it’d be more expensive for me to live there compared to here.

    And I hear you on Chicago. Great city. The most beautiful skyline in the US, in my opinion. Great parks, great neighborhoods, great food, great culture, and a fantastic lakefront. But the winter is brutal. Way too brutal for me. I spent a few days there in the winter back maybe ten years ago now. It was literally the coldest I’d ever been. I thought I was going to die – I felt like dying, anyway. No joke. Even if it were cheaper than here in SW Florida, I couldn’t live there. No way.

    Best wishes!

  31. JC,

    I definitely agree. Finances should play a role, but one’s decision on where they live should be based on a lot more than that. Quantitatively and qualitatively, this area offers a lot to like, though. Especially so for those seeking this lifestyle we talk about.

    Moving here was absolutely the right call. One of the best things I’ve ever done. I’m fortunate.

    Enjoy Texas! I think that’s the only state that can really compare fairly well across the board.

    Best regards.

  32. As far as taxes go, Washington is another state with no income tax. I’ve thought that living in a Washington city near the border with Oregon (e.g. Vancouver, WA) is the way to go for those not wanting to pay much in the way of taxes. You can live in Washington and earn your income without state taxes, and then go over to Oregon to buy things without sales tax. Win-win. 😀

    However, Washington state does lack much of the temperature benefits that you discussed.

  33. Jason,

    Another solid article. I have to say I have made reading your blog and dividendgrowthinvestor’s blog part of my daily routine. So many small bits of info I pick up every time I swing by the blogs

    I really enjoy seeing my personal balance sheet improve and my forward passive income grow. Focusing on growing a healthy balance sheet and an ever-growing passive cash flow stream really takes out the anxiety and worry in investing. This mindset also seems to make paying down debt an easier endeavor because it puts things into perspective in that I’m building something great for the long term.

    By the way, it’s been around 90 here up in Cleveland, OH this week. For whatever reason people complain and seem to completely forget the 4-5 months of dreadful cold we deal with here in northeast Ohio. To hell with that! I went to the beach three times in a week. Rare up here!

    Cheers!

    Mike

  34. I used to call on a customer in Tampa and LOVED it. South Florida – not so much. Crossing the bay is so beautiful and St. Pete had affordable rooms right on the beach.

    People often say that taxes even out. As someone who moved to an income tax state(Arkansas) from a non-income tax state(Tennessee) I can tell you that is not the case. I pay around 7% income tax and all other taxes(housing, sales, etc) are essentially the same. Makes you wonder what these high tax states are doing with all that money!

  35. David,

    Definitely. Florida isn’t the only state out there without income tax. Although, I happen to find it the most attractive option for many of the reasons I laid out.

    I’ve read a few opinion pieces by people who live out in Vancouver, and apparently the jaunt to Portland isn’t a realistic everyday trip just to save on sales tax. Maybe if you have to make a big purchase, though. But I don’t pay much in sales tax anyway down here, so it’s not much of a benefit at all.

    The Pacific NW seems beautiful, but people who have lived up there keep telling me how miserable the weather is for about seven months per year. Not just the rain, but the constant gray sky. I’m solar powered, so I might “power down” up there. 🙂

    Cheers!

  36. Mike,

    Thanks for the kind words. Glad you’re enjoying the blog! 🙂

    Saving and investing is definitely addictive. The more you save, the more you want to save. The more you invest, the more you want to invest. The more dividend income you generate, the more you want to generate. Success begets success.

    Enjoy the hot temps up there. You’re making the most of it. That’s the right way to go.

    Best regards.

  37. JayP,

    It’s a really beautiful area. Glad you loved it. 🙂

    I hear you there on taxes. I’ve always heard the same thing – there’s no free lunch. Hasn’t worked out that way for me, though. I suppose it depends on how you earn and spend, but those living a lifestyle congruent with achieving early financial independence will surely benefit from seeing more exposure to a consumption tax like sales tax and less exposure to income taxes.

    Cheers!

  38. Hi DM,

    I haven’t been writing but I haven’t stopped reading :). I found this post particularly interesting since I have Florida as one of the possible places I would like to end up on one day. The combination of low costs, decent salaries, great taxes and a beautiful place with amazing weather sounds almost too good to be true. Since you’re a local I would ask, in your opinion, what do you see as a downside of Florida both in general and comparatively to other place you have lived in? 🙂

    Best Wishes and happy to see you doing so well,
    Dividend Venture

  39. DV,

    Hey, good to hear from you. Hope all is well over there!

    Glad the post provided you some value. Sounds like we share similar ideas about Florida.

    That’s a good question there about drawbacks. I’d say the biggest drawback relates to the populace I mentioned in my first point, and it’s a drawback only in certain areas of Florida. I want to eventually move closer to Tampa Bay where there are a lot more young people around. We live about an hour south of Tampa proper, and I find myself sometimes surrounded by old people. I mean no offense by it, but the demographics can sometimes bum me out. I’d just prefer to spend more time around people my own age now that I no longer need that “push”. But I still do find almost daily motivation from it all.

    The other drawback is personal to me. I prefer the general architecture and “feel” of northern cities. I like old buildings built of brick. I like walkable downtown areas with lots of infill. We lack cities with robust downtowns like a, say, Chicago. Miami and Miami Beach are the closest cities with similar atmospheres, but it’s just not the same, in my view. But those kinds of cities – Boston, NYC, Chicago, etc. – come with drawbacks that outweigh the benefits when trying to life a lifestyle in line with achieving goals related to financial independence. Just my view on it. It’s actually a dream of mine to live in a nice, small loft right in the middle of a walkable downtown area. But I hate cold weather. Gotta make the best of it all. Maybe I’ll find myself somewhere else when money no longer matters. I do quite love it here, though. We’ll see. 🙂

    Hope that helps. Stay in touch!

    Best wishes.

  40. Yep, people are still moving to Austin so housing prices are going up–faster than my income. But my house is paid off, so as long as I can afford the property taxes (high in Texas) and upkeep, that’s okay for me. And if I can’t afford it anymore–it’s time to sell for a big profit and move somewhere affordable.

  41. In my state we have low taxes but to go with that we have low services. Pretty bad education, pretty bad healthcare if you’re poor or mentally ill, etc.

  42. You paint a nice picture of FL and I do have family on the east coast of the state near Ft. Lauderdale/Hollywood. It has crossed my mind as a place to end up though I might prefer living an expat lifestyle. I love to travel and relish the idea of living in Thailand, Ecuador, Panama, Belize and the like. Mrs. DivHut is from a non tax state as well, WA but the cost of living here is pretty high from what I can see. I’m actually in Seattle now visiting with the in-laws and showing baby DivHut off. Finding that “perfect” place is certainly a very personal choice it’s great that you have found your Shangri-La.

  43. You make a great case for Florida however I still enjoy having all 4 seasons so I think I’ll stay in the mid-atlantic area. I would love to spend a year or two right on the beach with the warm weather all year round but I just don’t think I could do that right now. I’m glad you’ve found your resting place. Look forward to where you’ll move next, I just hope you make another change soon… I love living vicariously through you. Knowing that there is someone out there doing what they love and being completely free and happy with the way their life has turned out is a great feeling. You are a true American success story. Congrats dude!

    My wife and I live a very good life as well and currently I would not change a thing but I can’t wait to see what the future holds. Just trying to live one day at a time and we will see where the wind blows.

    Nice post and I’ll be sure to get down there in the near future!

    ADD

  44. Hi Jason
    During the winter months, their is a lot of times I wish I lived in Florida. I love my home here north Georgia but the winters wear me down. I just don’t like being cold. I can take the summer, fall, and spring here in Georgia but the winters get to me now. I still have a few more years till I retire(I am 48 now). I have started to thinking about getting a sailboat and sail around to different countries and enjoy what they have to offer (weather,people,lower cost of living) or maybe moving abroad. If I don’t Florida is most defiantly on the radar screen to move too. Well see how it goes. I would love to be able to walk the beach each morning and enjoy the weather year round. Enjoy the sunshine state Jason.
    Cheers

  45. Jason,

    Being your neighbor almost (I live in clearwater) I have to agree with the financial benefits of living here. However, living in this state seriously brings me down, I’m from way up north and grew up surrounded by mountains and massively miss the view and the air that I had in the north. My wife being from here loves all of the things you mentioned but as for me I don’t go to the beaches often not because of lack of time but because of lack of interest. I think this is a great article just this state is not for me. That’s kind of the benefit of becoming financially independent though you can live wherever you want.

    Tyler

  46. I agree with everything, except the notion that the weather is fantastic. I am a Floridian. I’ve lived in Brevard County Florida from the age of 4 to 25. The humid weather lasts just too long. Hot is one thing, but hot and humid is another. I can deal with hot, but Florida is one of those places where you sweat large pit stains just standing in place outside doing nothing…and it’s like this from April through December most years. In fact, my folks were running the AC in December this past year! Having said all this, I’d still take the Florida humidity over northern winters. However, I cannot say Florida has fantastic weather. Maybe fantastic weather for a short visit, but it gets to be a bit much when you have to deal with it from April through December. I left Florida at the age of 25 for the Navy. I’ve since lived in many spots. The best…by far…has been Monterey California. 70 degrees by day, mid 40s/50s at night – damn near year round! Sooooooo expensive to live here though. I’ll retire back to Florida when I retire from service, but only because it is my home.

  47. Not hot everywhere in the summer…62 for a high here on the central Oregon coast today which is about normal during the summer. No sales tax either but atrocious income and property taxes.

  48. DH,

    Living life as an expat doesn’t sound bad at all. Definitely something that has crossed my mind from time to time, but I also think there are so many beautiful/amazing places I’d like to also see right here in the US. But Thailand and Ecuador both offer pretty amazing lifestyles on the real cheap. 🙂

    Seattle seems like a fantastic city. But expensive and poor weather (unless you love gray and rain) for a good chunk of the year. Can’t have it all, though!

    Thanks for dropping by!

    Best regards.

  49. ADD,

    Thanks so much. Appreciate the kind words! I’m super fortunate to be in this position.

    One thing that’s really fortunate for me is that I’m free to really live anywhere now. I’m very geographically independent, which is an amazing feeling. Although, Claudia’s not. She could probably work anywhere as well, but she wants to stay here while her son is in school for a few more years. But after that, we’ll be pretty free. So who knows? Tough to find anywhere that stacks up well against this area, all in all, but there are a lot of great places to live and see, both here and abroad. 🙂

    I sometimes miss the four seasons, but then I remember that summer was the only one that was really “great” for me. Winter and spring were usually cold and wet up north. And fall was typically rather short. So I guess I decided to just live where there’s one long summer. If I could live somewhere where there was four seasons with a pronounced summer and fall with a very, very mild winter, I’d consider it. But places with mild weather tend to be super expensive. Some areas of California jive well for me, statistically. And if the Pac NW weren’t so rainy in the winter, that’d be another great option. But, again, expensive with high taxes to boot.

    The future is very, very exciting. And we’re becoming more free and flexible every single day. 🙂

    Thanks for stopping in!

    Cheers.

  50. Michael,

    I hear you completely. The winters wear me down as well. The cold and lack of sunshine isn’t very fun. But then up in Michigan we used to get a ton of snow as well. It just all combined to make life kind of miserable for me. Maybe if one out of the three weren’t present so much – cold, gray, or snow – I could make it, but all three just sucked.

    Sailing around sounds really interesting and fun. I once ran into a guy who lived on his small sailboat. He told me how he picked the boat up pretty cheap many, many years ago and just lived on it for basically free. He paid no mooring fees to anyone and just had a little dinghy he would take to shore and find odd jobs for cash. He cleaned boats a lot of the time, from what I remember. Seemed to be a super interesting way to get by. I was working at the car dealership at the time and told him I was aiming for a similar level of freedom, albeit using a different method. A lot of roads lead to Rome. 🙂

    Best of luck getting to where you want to be!

    Cheers.

  51. Tyler,

    It’s definitely not for everyone. I hear you there. If the topography, sunshine, and beaches aren’t your thing, then you’re probably ultimately not going to be very happy here… or not as happy as you could/should be. I’m not the type of person that really thrives doing anything that one can do around mountains – hiking, biking, snowboarding, etc. – but I can lay on a beach with the best of them.

    Hopefully, you can score the geographical independence that comes with financial independence sooner rather than later and then convince your wife of the benefits of living near some mountains. 🙂

    Keep it up!

    Best wishes.

  52. Chris,

    Some people like heat more than others, no doubt about that. Heat doesn’t bother me nearly as much as cold, though I don’t like being uncomfortably hot any more than the next guy. Although, I strongly disagree with “…and it’s like this from April through December most years.” The weather stats don’t lie (I prefer stats over anecdotes), and it shows that it’s just not that hot all those months. The average high for Tampa in April is 81 degrees. May is 87. June, July, August, and September are all pretty hot, but, like I wrote, it’s hot in a lot of places during the summertime. And I think it’s worth a slightly hotter/longer summer to get a much, much nicer 2/3 of the rest of the year. The average highs for October, November, and December are 84, 78, and 72, respectively. I don’t find myself with large sweat stains in 78-degree weather. That’s just me, I guess. I personally find the eight months outside of June to Sept. as pretty amazing.

    Although, I wouldn’t disagree that a good chunk of California sports overall better weather. But then it becomes a question as to whether or not you want to deal with high expenses and high taxes. I think, all in all, Florida offers a lot to like. But to each their own. 🙂

    Take care!

  53. Randall,

    Wow. That’s fairly cool for the dead of summer. Although, I think 62 might be a little too cool for me personally in the summertime. That’s jacket weather for this Florida boy. 🙂

    I’m not super familiar with all of Oregon, but I’ve done fairly extensive research on the Portland area. I’ve heard over and over again how perfect the summers are there, but it does get rather hot fairly routinely, from what I can see. I just googled their weather and these are the expected highs for the next week: 95, 99, 98, 95, 93, 93, 93. The humidity is lower, but the “feels like” temp isn’t that far off because those temps are substantially higher than what we’re getting right now. And a few forum boards seem to indicate that air conditioning isn’t quite as prevalent (compared to here) up that way, meaning there isn’t as much relief from the heat. Add in the eight months of rain/gray, high taxes, and relatively expensive lifestyle, and I can’t make a compelling case for Portland. Nonetheless, I have to check it out for myself at some point here. Seems like a beautiful city.

    Thanks for dropping by!

    Best regards.

  54. Definitely, FL is a great place to visit and enjoy your vacation, no doubt about that, DM. However, I’m not completely sold on living in retirement, due to hurricane seasons, I hear all kind of news. Great post!

  55. I think the part about income tax is exaggerated. Typically a 6% state income tax isn’t levied on the first dollar of income earned, so if you earned $40,000 your tax bill would be less than $2400 per year. In general, I agree that moderate to lower cost areas often work out better in terms of prevailing wages vs. total cost of living, but let’s not exaggerate.

  56. R2R,

    Hurricanes are one of the more preferable natural disasters, in my view, compared to many alternatives. I’m not saying I’d like to live through one or anything, but you at least get ample warning. Tornadoes, earthquakes, and fires can all be rather sudden and very lethal. I’ll take my chances down here.

    Tampa hasn’t been hit directly in almost 100 years, so I think that points to low overall odds and probably not something to really worry about on an everyday basis. The higher odds of getting directly hit is one of the reasons (among many) I don’t live in the Miami area.

    But, believe me, I’m not trying to talk anyone into living here. Just pointing out the benefits for others. The less people that live here, the better. Cheaper rent for me. 🙂

    Cheers!

  57. Mysticaltyger,

    Right. It’s illustrative, but I factored brackets in. If you live in, say, Oregon (a state I kept mentioning), you’re going to be hitting that 9% bracket pretty quickly, as I pointed out. The 9% is paid on anything above $8,251. That means you’re exposing about $32,000 to 9%. The 5% bracket is the lowest bracket they offer, on up to $3,300 of income. Looking at that, 6% is being conservative.

    No exaggerating here. Grab a calculator and get back to me.

    Edit to add: I’m not interested in arguing about state income taxes. There are 50 states, all of them with different tax rules. Again, it was illustrative. I said 6% isn’t uncommon, and it’s not. Your mileage will obviously vary. But I wasn’t exaggerating the point. Some will pay 6%. Some more. Some less. Either way, every dollar you send the state is one less dollar in your pocket. And living in a high-tax state doesn’t mean you’ll also see a lower cost of living to offset that. In fact, it’s quite the contrary often enough. That’s really the bottom line.

    Take care.

  58. Jason,

    The Florida tourism dept. will be very please count on your support for the next campaign! You just gave the envy to come and visit Florida.

    Regarding retirement, I am like you we will retire in Brazil, north-east and by the beach where climate is very similar.

    Very well written article.

    Cheers, RA50

  59. RA50,

    I think Florida owes me some money for this piece! 🙂

    Best of luck with Brazil. Sounds like a great way to go. Warm weather, beaches, sunshine… life could be a lot worse.

    Best wishes.

  60. Hi Jason,

    Great post. It gave me some reasons to re-think about one day living in Florida, whereas I’d written it off previously.

    I was reading an article that mentioned that the geography of Florida is porous limestone. That being the case, the underground aquifer ends up getting brackish from ocean water. Have you encountered this? Florida is quite susceptible to rising sea levels and subsidence, so this could be problematic over a few decades if not sooner. Of course the fact that you rent means you are better able to move if something were to occur…

    Your description of the weather there is a lot like what we get in Bangkok, Thailand. Now it’s more cloudy with intermittent showers and this morning was a cool 74 F but the temperatures climb up into the upper 80’s / low 90’s every day of the year. Winters don’t get colder than 68F at night and only last a few weeks, in December – February. Peak heat is April – June but getting above 100 F is extremely uncommon. Many folks here don’t have water heaters for their shower and are find year round. There is also very affordable health care here- for example and MRI at the top private hospital in the country is around $300, about 8-10 times less than in the USA. Cars and owning property is very costly here but you could live a great and somewhat decadent lifestyle on what you spend there each month.

    Other bonuses out here are no state income tax, no FICA and no medicare taxes, So that has saved me quite a bit during the decade I’ve lived and worked out here. I’ve been able to save up a good bit and have now deployed that into a dividend growth portfolio. Definitely consider living overseas, or at least coming out for a visit. The people are pretty friendly and the culture is quite different. I am a much richer person having lived overseas, and I suspect you will be too.

    -Mike

  61. Speaking of Portland, I live in Vancouver, WA, just across the Columbia River from Portland Oregon. No income tax in Washington state, but I have Portland just across the river and a 10 minute drive to downtown from my front door. Plus Vancouver is a great city in its own right (2nd/3rd largest in WA after Seattle and Spokane depending on how you count). Temperate climate, mountains (Hood, St. Helens, Rainier, Adams), Pacific ocean within less than 2 hour drive, green trees, waterfalls, the Columbia river gorge, little to no snow in the winter, plus they pump your gas in Oregon. Come check it out!

  62. Mike,

    Glad it provided some food for thought. I’m definitely not saying Florida is the best place to live, but it offers a lot to like for this lifestyle.

    There have been some sinkholes that have developed around the Tampa Bay area, but rarely do they cause death or injury. This article actually shows a map of the US where you can find that limestone. Certainly not contained to just Florida (or even the US):

    http://www.businessinsider.com/where-youll-be-swallowed-by-a-sinkhole-2013-3

    As far as rising sea levels, it won’t be sudden. The predictions are all over the place. I highly doubt I’ll encounter a problem before I’m dead. If it becomes an issue, I’ll move. Of course, that would affect many places if it came to that, not just Florida. I’ll most likely be dead before it comes to that, though.

    Thailand is definitely at the top of my list if I ever move abroad. Specifically Chiang Mai. Great beaches, great food, nice weather, and really attractive cost of living there in Thailand. We’ll see if I ever make it out there. There are a few places I’d like to see here in the US as well.

    Enjoy the lifestyle out there. Sounds like you have it made! 🙂

    Best regards.

  63. David,

    I’ve considered that – living in Vancouver and then commuting to Portland. But I quite dislike the idea of commuting anywhere at all. Might be 10 minutes by car, but I bet it’s a lot more without one. If I were to ever move out that way, it’d be to live right in the middle of Portland’s action so that I could walk everywhere. So I’d want to live in the Pearl District, downtown, or maybe even the NW/Alphabet area. I’ve looked into Vancouver, and it’s just not for me. Not to say it’s not a great city, but not what I’m looking for. But living there gives you a pretty solid tax arbitrage situation, assuming you consume enough to make the commute worth it. I personally don’t pay much in sales tax. But if you had to buy some large one-time items, the trip would definitely be worth it.

    The weather is such a bummer out there, but I suppose that keeps a lot of people out of the area. I’ve heard it described as a natural barrier to entry. It’s nature’s check on immigration. Ha!

    If Portland had nicer weather and no income tax, I’d be there in a heartbeat. But I suppose everyone else would be as well. 🙂

    I do agree with you on the beautiful nature, though. The Columbia River Gorge looks amazing. Multnomah Falls, the Oregon Coast, Mt. Hood, Blue Canyon Lake, Forest Park, etc. I recently looked into apartments around the downtown/Pearl areas of Portland, and… wow. Pricey stuff out there. Factor in the state income tax and I’d be too far behind. But maybe in five or ten years. You never know!

    Thanks for sharing. It’s a secret dream of mine to live out there. But the pragmatic side of me knows it would be a more expensive place for me to live, and possibly even subpar. And I say that because I’m not sure how I’d react to the gray/rain for a good chunk of the year. I had mild seasonal affective disorder back in Michigan, but I think that was exacerbated by the snow and cold. Portland’s winter temps are much more mild, with a lot less snow. Either way, people who have lived up that way have described it as pretty brutally depressing for 6-8 months per year.

    Best regards!

  64. If I lived in the US then Florida would absolutely be at the top of my list (not least of which is because of my wife’s love of DisneyWorld! Surely that was number 6 on your list 😉 ).

    Weather and natural beauty are two huge factors for me. I love where we currently live and would (will?) happily retire here, but Melbourne has become a ridiculously expensive city!

  65. Hey Jason

    You can be very happy to live in Florida! For us it is a long way from germany to go. Nevertheless, we spend our hollidays this year in Florida and made a nice round trip (Miami, Cocoa-Beach, Mickey Mouse, Clearwater B., Sanibel Island, Everglades, Key West, Miami). It cost us a nice sum of bugs, but we like traveling to see the world. I like Florida a lot, and it is really a nice land to retire.

    In germany we pay approx. 26 % tax on dividend or stock income (gains with selling). This make a huge diffence to Florida, where you have nothing to pay. I guess in europe these taxes will go up further in the next decates. In numbers: If I need $ 20,000.00 a year to retire, I guess with a withdrawel rate of 4 % I will need $ 500,000.00 to retire. But in germany I will need approx. $ 675,000.00 ! That´s a real difference. Especially during the long saving phase, taxes on dividends matter a lot.

    Best regards

    Marco

  66. I was born in North Central Florida and haven’t left since. I love it!

    The weather certainly earns its rep on some days during the summer, but I agree that it’s not as bad as most people make it out to be. The rain comes and goes, but it’s predictable IMO, especially during the summer (late afternoon, evening showers).

    Your point about affordable housing is great. I live in an apartment that runs close to $600 per month. And I’m smack dab in the middle of bustling college town, with access to great eats, transportation, entertainment, lakes, and I’m just 60 minutes from the closest beach. (45 if you drive like my partner). 

    As my partner and I consider our future career paths, we very seriously consider staying in Fl. The only caveat is, having been here for 24 years, some change in scenery (even just temporary), would be welcomed. As it turns out, my partner is actually getting a good dose of that in a couple weeks, because he is moving to TX for a temporary position to finish his PhD.

    Take care,
    Dylan

  67. I would love to vacation for about a month or so per year in Ft. Lauderdale. I love that city. Hopefully our cash flow in retirement will be ample enough to fund that as to avoid touching any capital. I figure living well for a month in that city will cost about $5,000 after flights / travel expenses. That’s the plan.

    Mark

  68. Portland does get surprisingly hot in the summer. The traffic is also miserable. However, you can do a pretty awesome double-dip by living just over the boarder in Vancouver, WA. No income tax in WA and then you could do most of your shopping in OR with no sales tax. If you ever come out this way, head to the coast that’s where it’s at. No disrespect to your beaches down in FL, but it’s incredibly beautiful here. Check out some images of Seal Rock, which is near where I live in the summer. A wonderful vacation and drive is down the OR coast to the Redwoods National Forest. Doesn’t get much better than that.

  69. Jason,

    Making me want to travel! All excellent reasons. Personally, I want a place with mountains right next to a tropical beach, but high enough that I can go skiing. That place exists right? Anyway, a great place indeed especially if it works for you!

    Side note, DC is hotter and sticky right now than you posted. Trust me on that one.

    – Gremlin

  70. Sounds like Florida is a great place for retirees or people seeking for early retirement. It makes sense why so many Canadians retire down in Florida. Still need to go to Florida one of these days.

  71. When I visited the Keys it was really fun. Deciding where to swim, Golf of Mexico or Pacific Ocean, that was great. 🙂

  72. Perhaps Brevard is different than where you are, but it is not uncommon at all for it to be super humid in Oct, Nov, and Dec. Definitely not an anecdote. I’ve experienced it for 21 years. I agree though, all-around, Florida is a great place to live. Mosquitoes are horrible in the summer too…forgot to mention that. Not to mention those pesky FIRE ants.

  73. you’re right about Florida. If you’re already in the vacation spot, there is no reason to take a vacation LOL :), it is especially great for the early retirement community. I wish my families are all in FL, but then again, growing up in the midwest (generally quiet), allowed me to concentrate on my studies, lead me to a completely different path than growing up in Manhantan or Hollywood.

  74. Jason
    I presently live in Northern Colorado and I have been retired for about 8 1/2 years. CO has some very good places to live and of course some bad places to live. It all depends on what you want. We enjoy the four seasons and of course our grandchildren live about 70 miles away which is important. I also know a couple that has a mailing address in SD and they spend the winter in the Phoenix area and use their motor home to spend summer in the mountains near Phoenix. They have the best of both worlds. No state taxes and very low taxes on their motor home. So I guess it works out to whatever floats your boat! HAH

  75. Jason,

    Super jealous of you over there, my friend. I hear Melbourne is an amazing city. Always ranks very highly when those quality of life rankings come around. Not jealous of the expenses, but it does appear to be a pretty fantastic place to live. Always right up there with some of the northern European and Canadian cities, except you guys don’t have to deal with brutal winters.

    As a DIS shareholder, I should have definitely listed Disney World as reasons #1 through #5. But I think some might have accused me as being biased. 🙂

    Cheers!

  76. Thanks for the excellent article and the great timing. Right now I’m spending one month in Florida on vacation and prospecting some cities all the way from Ft. Lauderdale to Jacksonville (because I need to surf) to possibly move in with my family next year. We’re in our mid-30s, and I’m lucky that my current San Francisco Bay Area job allows me to relocate here to work remotely keeping the same salary.

    I would say I’m pretty much on the same page as you. My main concern at this point is what to do after this job. Working in the software industry, it’s easy to get another job with a similar pay in the Silicon Valley in case something goes wrong – you just cross the street. In the other hand, the current cost of living in the SF Bay Area is simply insane, and the extra money left to invest living in Florida would make a HUGE difference, even if I have to relocate back to CA in a couple years in case of disaster.

    Doing the homework now: find a good balance between school for the kid, future job availability, proximity to the ocean, house pricing, etc. Looks like Ft. Lauderdale?

  77. Marco,

    That’s unfortunate over there regarding the taxation. I certainly wouldn’t disagree that taxation shouldn’t be the only/first thing someone thinks about when deciding where to live, but it’s surely something that comes to mind pretty quickly for me. Why live somewhere that taxes you if you don’t have to? We’re really fortunate here in the US to be able to freely move to such disparate locations. You want mountains, you can get them. You want beaches, you can have those, too. No need for residency headaches or anything else. All in one country.

    Hope you guys get more opportunities to travel (to here and other places) in the future! 🙂

    Best wishes.

  78. Dylan,

    That’s a great spot to be in. I can tell you from personal experience that I investigated a move to Ann Arbor, MI last year. Also a bustling college town. But you aren’t getting an apartment in the middle of it all for $600 per month. No way, no how. And that’s before factoring in taxes and weather. All in all, it’s pretty advantageous to live here.

    I hear you on different scenery, though. The world’s a big place. I’m certainly open minded to living elsewhere down the road, once I’m closer to financial independence and money isn’t perhaps as much of a concern anymore. But I’d be living elsewhere probably knowing that it’s pretty tough to beat what we already have down here. 🙂

    Thanks for stopping in!

    Cheers.

  79. Mark,

    Ft. Lauderdale is a beautiful city. A bit expensive for me, but $5,000/month would certainly go quite far there. The canals, beach, and downtown areas are all quite nice. Very clean, too. And you’re not far from Miami if you want to do something there.

    I’m sure you guys will achieve your cash flow numbers at your pace! 🙂

    Best regards.

  80. Randall,

    Yeah, I’ve never at all been interested in living in Vancouver. Someone else actually mentioned that. That’d be akin to wanting to live in Chicago and then moving out to Schaumburg, in my view. A poor substitute for actually living in the city, if that’s what you’re after.

    The coast is very, very pretty out there. But also very different beaches. People don’t travel from all over the world to sunbathe on the Oregon Coast. And the water stays pretty cold all year long. However, for natural beauty, it’s tough to beat those beaches out there. Seal Rock looks amazing. As does Cannon Beach. 🙂

    Cheers!

  81. Gremlin,

    D.C. gets pretty nasty in the summer, from what I hear. And there’s a heat wave going on right now. Of course, it seems like we get one of those “heat waves” every year.

    I suspect you’ll find your paradise somewhere in the world. Even better if you can live there while collecting passive income! 🙂

    Cheers.

  82. Tawcan,

    Yeah, I never understood why anyone would wait until they’re old to finally enjoy the sunshine, beaches, and blue sky. I guess if you have to take a big pay cut, that’s one thing. But I actually made a lot more money down here than I ever did in Michigan. And I paid less in taxes. 🙂

    If you ever make it down, let me know. It’d be great to meet up for coffee or something!

    Best regards.

  83. Chris,

    I only meant your experience was an anecdote because it doesn’t line up well with the weather stats. I’ll put my bet on stats over anecdotes any day of the week. And my personal experience is quite a bit different from yours, but perhaps South Florida is a bit different than what we get here. Can’t imagine it’s significantly different, though.

    As far as mosquitoes go, I’ve never once been bitten while I’ve lived here. Not once. They spray for those things. I used to get killed up north, especially where my parents live out in the country. It was almost impossible to have a backyard BBQ in the summertime. I can’t say I’ve even seen a mosquito down here.

    Take care!

  84. Vivianne,

    Exactly. Why not move to the place everyone else vacations at? 🙂

    The Midwest is a great area to live as well. The weather isn’t my favorite, but you generally get those tight-knit communities, low cost of living, and easy lifestyle.

    Best regards!

  85. Brent,

    I’ve heard of a lot of people that do that with their RV travels. They set up their domicile in a state with no state income tax and then zoom around the country. Great form of arbitrage there.

    Colorado seems quite nice. The Denver area has a lot to like, especially around LoDo and the 16th Street Mall. Weather wouldn’t be my favorite, but it’s a pretty mild way to get all four seasons, relatively speaking. 🙂

    Thanks for dropping by!

    Cheers.

  86. Marcelo,

    Glad you found some value here. Looks like I published it at just the right time. 🙂

    Yeah, I suspect you’d save enough money very quickly to offset any risk from losing your job. Unless you don’t think it’s at all secure. But if you think the odds are high you’ll still be doing it for at least five years, I imagine your war chest would build faster than the risk piles up. Just my take on it. But that’s a personal call.

    Best of luck finding the right place. A lot of options in the state for pretty much anyone and everyone.

    Cheers!

  87. The most amazing beach I’ve been to is out by you in Sanibel Island. So, Many. Shells! I occasionally see parents coerce their kids into the ocean out here for the experience, that usually doesn’t last too long 🙂

    Take it easy..

  88. Those are some pretty convincing reasons to live in Florida. Good weather and low/no taxes alone! Only drawback I see is that the public transit could be a bit better, although biking around would certainly make up for that quite a bit. Glad you are back there and enjoying it!

  89. Jason,

    I’m 30years old, and I know you favor taxable accounts, but do you think it’s good idea for those planning on retiring early to max out a 401k? I happen to be one of those people, but I’m debating on whether on not to reduce those contributions in order to be able to contribute more to my taxable account.

    I might not mind paying the 10% penalty each year that I’m in “early retirement”. The way I see it is that the invested saved tax portion should grow enough to easily cover the 10% penalty of the total annual withdraw.

    the math:

    The current max out amount per month = 1,500.
    1500x.75 = $1,125
    1500x.25(payroll tax) = $375

    $1,125/month for 15years & 8% return shows = $394K
    Tax savings portion = $375/month for 15years & 8% return shows = $132k
    Total = $526k

    4% withdraw of $526k = $21,040
    10% penalty of $526k -2,104
    Total taxable income 18,936

    In this example, the 10% penalty is only a 1.59%($2,104/$132k) withdraw rate of the $132k.

    Your thoughts?

  90. Interesting article Jason about Florida.

    I have been retired for over 20 years and my wife and I spent the last eight travelling around the USA by motorhome. I found that each state has something special to offer. Primarily it comes down to preferences, lifestyle, family, and income. I have spent the past 30 years in Oregon as my home state, after working in the Bay area (Palo Alto) for over 20 years. Loved California for the money, but hated it for the lifestyle. Simply couldn’t get out of the population centers easily to reach the great outdoors … rivers, mountains, and seashore. I gave up a great career to move to Eugene where I can fish in town, bicycle along country roads, garden year round, and hike and kayak a few miles from town center. As a university town it has everything for me. And, I chose to retire here as well.

    Regarding retirement taxes…Oregon is famous for a 9.9 % state income tax, no sales tax and lots of rain. The reality is: I haven’t paid taxes since I retired, either federal or state. I say again…I pay no taxes. Why? There are so many exclusions for seniors that one has to make over (approximate) $50,000 a year when on Social Security. We live very comfortably on $3000 a month. Unfortunately, our retirement annuity company went bankrupt causing us to adopt a much simpler lifestyle than originally planned, but we have had a wonderful retirement, including living overseas for five years. My point here is: statistics don’t tell the whole picture about retirement. Those articles that come out annually for the top ten places to retire are written to sell magazines. It’s very important that each individual experience life in the state of choice. You love Florida…and I love Oregon. Both great places to retire for different reasons and lifestyle preferences. Taxes are not as important as the periodicals and so called experts make them out to be.

  91. DW,

    Tough to go wrong with great weather, palm trees, beautiful beaches, blue sky, no income tax, and a low cost of living. 🙂

    But I do agree with you in regards to the public transportation. Of course, that’s a knock on any area in the US outside of, say, NYC, Boston, Chicago, D.C., Portland, Philadelphia, San Fran, etc. There are only a few major cities in the whole country with really solid public transportation options. Miami isn’t bad, though. Bus coverage is robust and some of the buses run 24 hours per day. And you have the Metrorail and Metromover down there as well. I think you could easily live in downtown Miami or anywhere in the South Beach area easily without a car.

    But I live without a car in a fairly small city, so it’s not all that tough. Like I wrote, it’s easy to wait for a bus (or walk, bike, scoot, etc.) in mostly beautiful weather. I think that’s preferable to waiting for the L in Chicago in the middle of January and then schlepping around town in the cold and snow. Just my take.

    Best regards!

  92. I hear you on that. The rents are pricey in this area. Plus, us northwesterners who enjoy a cloudy day see it as a method to control the population! I’ve been in your area, driving through on vacation, and it is a wonderful area. I actually could see myself living down along the gulf coast just for the palm trees and weather. Keep up the saving and as you know, home is where you are and what you make of it. I wish you a great second half to the year!

  93. I just got back from a vacation in FL. I live in Austin, TX, I have driven down the beaches that Texas has to offer and I can say now that FL has better beaches.

    Texas does have some other cool things though. We have cool woodlands, glass lands, mountains, hill country, many lakes and of course desert.

    If you open to checking Texas out Austin is a great town.

  94. Joel,

    This is just a tad off topic here…

    I’m really loath to give tax advice. There are just way too many personal circumstances to take into account there. Many 401(k)s I’ve run into also have somewhat heavy fees, so that would have to be accounted for as well. If you think the math shows that you can outgrow the 10% penalty and come out ahead, go for it. That would depend on your tax bracket being much lower once you’re living off of your investment income, which is likely unless you’re earning active income as well. There are also hoops you can jump through to access money early without paying the penalty, but I long ago decided that hoop jumping isn’t an activity I’d much enjoy.

    Best regards.

  95. David,

    Good point there about Oregon not taxing SS income. I wasn’t necessarily directing this article toward traditional retirees. Rather, I was pointing out the benefits of avoiding state income taxes while you’re working and accumulating assets/passive income. I view SS income as just icing on the cake, though Florida doesn’t tax it, either. Besides taxes, Oregon offers a very different lifestyle, as you know. That’s really up to an individual to decide what works for them. But I think the weather here is far better than what most of Oregon offers, and I think most people who are familiar with both would agree.

    But I agree that taxes shouldn’t be the only consideration in deciding where to live. However, I do think they should be considered. Why would I want to live in a state that might collect 6% or more of my income when I don’t have to? Unless this other place is somehow magical or something or is just somehow far superior to the place that doesn’t tax me, it wouldn’t make sense to live there. I know for sure I’ve saved a lot of money living down here compared to living in high-tax areas that wouldn’t have offered enough income to offset the difference. And if I moved to Portland tomorrow, I’d be out more than $300/month just for the privilege of living there (before factoring in the MUCH higher housing and general COL). Is Portland worth $300/month? That’s up to an individual to decide. But it’s real cash money. And it’s just like going out and spending $300/month on a car or anything else. No different.

    Thanks for stopping by and sharing. Glad you’ve found your own little paradise over there. 🙂

    Best wishes.

  96. George,

    I don’t see myself ever moving to Texas, but I hear Austin is a great town. Glad you’re enjoying yourself out there. 🙂

    Hope you had a great time in Florida!

    Best regards.

  97. I’m currently in Utah (flat 5% income tax) and am debating between Washington and Florida as my next move. I am in the high desert — think Las Vegas instead of Salt Lake City — so it is very dry here. Even when I visit southern California (where I’m from) it is humid to me now.

    I like the idea of Florida beaches and sunshine, especially in the winter. I like the idea of lower temperatures in Washington, especially in the summers. I don’t know if I can stand a Florida summer or Washington winter. Perhaps I just need to have a more nomadic lifestyle and rent a room in Washington during the summer and Florida during the winter and do a little travel in between.

  98. Retirement in Florida made me think about taxes, but you’re right about this being a tad bit off topic.
    I also accidentally left out a big item- employer match & profit sharing contribution, which amounts to about 5,000/year of free money from my employer, and would add another $146k to my calculated end balance.

    Sorry for the off topic post, but I was just “thinking out loud”…especially when we’re having to pay taxes on dividends every year, as our taxable nest eggs grow.

    My plan is to eventually retire in a retiree-friendly(tax friendly) state like Florida, Oregon, or Washington(I think).

  99. Travis,

    That’s a tough call there. Sounds like you’d be best suited to somewhere like California. But then you have the taxes and COL. I think you’d spend a lot less money in Florida compared to Washington – if we’re talking bigger cities – but they’re totally different lifestyles. If you have the ability to stay in the PAC NW during the summer and FL in the winter, that might be the way to go. Best of both worlds. 🙂

    Good luck!

    Cheers.

  100. Joel,

    That match is very likely worth the stretch. I never had a match, so it was pretty easy for me to forgo a 401(k). But I can’t pass up free money. I’d have definitely taken advantage of a 401(k) with a match, if I had one.

    Oregon has a pretty high state income tax rate, like I mentioned in the article (and in numerous comments). But Florida and Washington both have no state income tax.

    Cheers!

  101. Hi Jason. Thanks for sharing a great article and viewpoint. I’ve been following your blog for the past year and like that you discuss both your investing purchases and personal life. I’ve also been considering moving to FL/TX for tax reasons since I’m currently in NYC. The biggest concern for me has been job prospects but I’m noticing more companies relocating to these states over the past few years. TX for example has so many new positions to fill that residential construction has been booming around the major cities. There’s this dynamic where companies want to be close to talent and won’t make major moves unless there are qualified employees in the new area. Similarly, the employees won’t move if there aren’t ample jobs available. So this dilemma continues until someone makes the first move and somehow things fall into place after all. Would be interesting to see if this continues. Until then, keep chasing the dream!

    -Alex

  102. Jason,

    Nice write-up of the Tampa area and Florida in general. We used to live in Daytona Beach years ago. We visit every year because of family still there, though that is about to change. We’ve visited Tampa area last year, and decided we need to go visit again…..didn’t much care for Tampa itself too much, but other places might be more to our liking. I’m desiring to ‘retire’ from my current occupation, and my wife can do her business from anywhere. We love our home in Pennsylvania, but the beaches are calling. We almost bought the condo we stayed in during our most recent trip to Daytona, but family health issues kept us from trying to do a real estate deal. You’ve got me re-thinking going back to Florida.

    Regarding Portland, my daughter lived there for 3 years and we visited a lot. LOVE that place. Went all over the area. But your research and friends are correct: the winter gray/rain is brutal, my daughter had to be treated for SAD, expensive real estate, traffic bad, high taxes. But great food and beer and scenery. I think just visiting there is the best option!

    Man…..Texas. I’ve always found that state to be great on paper, but the reality always fell short for me. Visited Austin a few times, and a cool place, don’t think I could really live there. I’m originally from Buffalo, NY, and on paper, that place SUCKS, but in actuality, a very nice place.

    Good luck in your journey to FI and collecting dividend checks…I’m on the same trip!

    Thanks,

    Sam

  103. Hi Jason, Once again another great article, I’ve got my young siblings and parents turned on to your wesite. I am curious, I’m doing a very simliar plan like you and I’m married with 2 kids and counting. How would you or are you going to change your investing/saving strategy plans if you have kids? If you ever plan on having kids would you move out of an apartment and try to buy a house with cash? Could you see yourself selling your holdings to buy a house with cash or would you take out a mortgage? Would you try and go back to working a 8-5 type of job? I think I’m leaning on the side of having to sell my holdings and in doing so I could probably buy a small 3 bedroom house with cash so at least we would stay debt free. I have a 2 year old and 7 month old. Kids are amazing and I would like to have at least around 5, my wife wants 10, I’m also trying to come up with strategies for them as far as investing, I’ve opened accounts in their name.I’m just wondering how you would plan or change if kids ever came along.

  104. I totally agree that Florida is one of the top FI-friendly places in the country. $925/month for a 900 sqft apartment is fantastic given all the other factors you mentioned. The advantage of not having state income taxes can never be understated, it’s money in your pocket and fewer paperwork headaches during tax season.

    When we head back to the states I think Florida will be a strong contender. I’m actually quite familiar with the state because I did two years of high school in Miami and I got my bachelor’s at FSU. At the time, it took me a while to warm up to the state but I eventually came to like it. Generally speaking, I think it’s easily one of the best states in the nation.

    Who knows, maybe one day we’ll end up in Sarasota!

  105. RUAK09,

    Appreciate you following along. Thanks for the readership! 🙂

    I hear you there on the move. It came down to Texas and Florida for me as well back in 2009. I had an opportunity in Houston, but the numbers and overall lifestyle seemed to indicate that Florida was the better choice. I don’t regret it.

    Best of luck finding a situation that works for you. If you can land a similar salary with a lower COL and no state income tax, you’d be in a pretty solid spot.

    Cheers!

  106. Sam,

    Sounds like the beaches are calling. 🙂

    I hear you completely on Portland. I haven’t been there, but it seems like such an amazing city. However, the weather, high COL, and high taxes all temper my enthusiasm. I had mild SAD in Michigan, and I’m not sure I’d do well out there. But a piece of me often thinks about trying it out. We’ll see. Maybe spending summers out there might be the way to go somewhere down the line…

    Yeah, I’ve actually heard good things about Buffalo. The snow is crazy. But they actually placed #1 on some survey I ran across not too long ago on walkable downtowns that were affordable. I think St. Louis was right up there as well. The pictures of Buffalo’s downtown seemed pretty nice. Couldn’t do winters there, though. I like not having to shovel sunshine.

    Appreciate the support. We’re on a great journey together. Every day just gets better and better!

    Best wishes.

  107. While we never really considered these things before moving to AZ, it has a lot of the same draws that Florida does. Low cost of living, very low taxes (especially low property taxes). High sales tax does not impact us as much since we’re frugal, and low/no taxes on grocery items. And, of course, the weather is overall pretty awesome. Like you said, it’s hot just about everywhere in the summer.

  108. Josh,

    Thanks so much for spreading the word like that. Hope they’re enjoying the site! 🙂

    I really can’t answer your question, though. I don’t have any children and won’t have any children. So it’s not a decision I’ll have to think much about. As such, I haven’t given it much thought. Anything that comes to mind would be complete conjecture. I will say that I’ve lived with Claudia and her son for years, and it hasn’t really changed anything at all for me. We keep separate budgets, which I’ve discussed before, but I can’t imagine it being much different if that weren’t the case. It’s not like her son requires a $50 bill whenever he wakes up. I honestly think that children are just like anything else in life – it’s all what you make it. If you want to make a family an expensive endeavor, it will be. If you want to stick to a plan, then that’s what you’ll do. All in what you want and what you’re willing to do to have it. If I had children, I’d be asking myself whether or not it was more important to buy them things or spend more time at home with them. I think you know the answer to that. 🙂

    Wish I could help more!

    Best regards.

  109. Spoonman,

    Ahh, you’re very familiar with Florida. Nice! 🙂

    I didn’t even mention paperwork headaches. Good call there. I hate paperwork. The less, the better. I had to do some extra work with TurboTax this year because of my time spent in Michigan last year. I ended up having to call into TurboTax’s support line because of all the extra work involved (especially with part-year resident stuff). Never again, if I can manage.

    Glad you get where I’m coming from. I think, objectively speaking, Florida is really one of the best options, all in all. Especially for those seeking out early retirement. Everyone has different desires in regards to lifestyles and everything, but, on paper, it’s tough to beat Florida. If we really wanted to, we could live anywhere else in the country. Claudia can get a job pretty much anywhere. And I’m mobile. But I haven’t really run across a better area than this. If I did, I would have moved there.

    If you ever end up this way, let me know. It’d be great to meet up for a coffee or something.

    Cheers!

  110. Jason,

    I love your term “geographical arbitrage.” What a great term to sum up the savings of not having a car, less utilities bills, no state income tax, less need for a car to live, and enjoyment year round of parks and outdoor recreation opportunities in a comfortable climate most of the year. Another thought provoking article on how to think about and design a lifestyle.

  111. DB40,

    Sounds like a pretty similar scenario over there. I personally prefer beaches over the desert, but to each their own on that one.

    But I never understood the complaints about Florida’s (or Arizona’s) summer temps. It’s 85 degrees right now here. It’s 90 in Detroit. The humidity isn’t that far off. It’s hot pretty much everywhere in July. You can’t tell people that, though. People tend to follow narratives in life, and that’s it.

    Thanks for stopping by!

    Best regards.

  112. The Aiki Trader,

    Thanks so much!

    Yeah, “lifestyle design” is really what it’s all about. Or life hacking. Whatever you want to call it. It’s basically just aligning your values with your actions and making your dreams come true.

    What I do is figure out what I don’t like and then avoid those things by doing the opposite.

    I don’t like being cold or shoveling snow. So I moved to Florida.

    I don’t like working until I’m 65 years old. So I figured out a way to quit my job and become financially independent quite early in life.

    I don’t like fixing things or cutting grass. I rent an apartment where others do that for me.

    This article is just more of all of that. 🙂

    Best wishes!

  113. BSR,

    I feel your pain. I grew up just west of Toronto. Cold, gray, snowy winters. But at least you have a world-class city over there. 🙂

    Cheers!

  114. I got a little confused, and you’re right about Oregon- I knew they were tax exempt, but you’re right, it’s not for income- the exemption is just for sales tax. Scratch Oregon off my list then.

  115. Jason,

    You had me at weather. How many brutal midwest winter near the Great Lakes can one person survive? If it weren’t for being close to my family, nieces, and nephews, I would most likely have taken a whirl in a much warmer area of the country. When I retire and hit financial freedom, I will not be spending my winters in Cleveland. A nice condo where Spring Training is sounds perfect to me!

    The key point is, Florida is awesome for someone like you and you did your research to find the perfect spot. It is the driver for your lifestyle. You wouldn’t be able to walk everywhere if it is brutally cold (You could, but it would be awful). Because of your location, you don’t have to incur an auto expense, the gas, or the insurance that comes along with it. Think about the savings that is right there. My auto expense is my largest monthly expense and I would kill to be a walkable city like you where I could sell that metal money pit. On top of that, how the heck could you complain about NO income tax. That’s just icing on the cake.

    Your decision was well thought out and educated and as you said, it is a great place to seek retirement if you can find a great location like you did!

    Bert

  116. Jason,

    Nice post. I lived in Orlando for 10 years and visit there often, but now live in North Carolina. Agree with your assessment of the weather. Summers are hotter and more humid here in NC than FL by a notable amount, but last about a month less.

    Long-term I wonder about the gradual rise of sea levels and the problems that could cause in FL. I guess mostly a problem for home owners and not so much renters.

    Thanks

    Greg

  117. Governor Scott owes you a piece of the sales tax revenue from all of the visitors, future residents, from your well written article! All the best Jason!

  118. Bert,

    Thanks for the kind words. As you can probably tell, I tend to think very carefully and do a lot of research when it comes to many things. Just the way I am. If I would have come up with a better solution than Florida across the board, I would have moved there. But I think, qualitatively and quantitatively, Florida offers far more benefits than drawbacks for those aiming for this lifestyle we’re after. 🙂

    You’re in a great spot over there, though. Every dollar you save and invest increases your flexibility and options. You’ll likely be in a position where you can live half the year up in Cleveland and half the year somewhere warmer. No need to wait until you’re 65 to snowbird it up!

    Keep it up over there. We’re achieving our dreams one day at a time.

    Best regards.

  119. Greg,

    That’s an interesting thought there in regards to rising sea levels. From what I’ve come across, it seems like it’ll be potentially problematic long after I’m dead. I’ve seen some predictions as soon as the turn of the next century, but I haven’t really read anything that predicts we’ll be losing our coastline in the next 20 or 30 years. I don’t see that happening. But if it does become a major problem, it’s quite easy to move. One more win for renting. 🙂

    Thanks for stopping by!

    Cheers.

  120. RTM,

    Ha! I’ll have to give him a call. We’ll see how that works out. 🙂

    Thanks for dropping by. Appreciate the support!

    Best regards.

  121. Great article and comments about living in Florida. I lived in Miami Lakes area for 3 years when my oldest daughter was born. I loved the weather and the fact you could dress in a T-shirt and shorts year round. Zero income tax was a bonus. The only thing missing were some hills or mountains.

    We now live in Northern AZ and this is the 13th lowest in the US for state income taxes. They range from 2.59% to a high of 4.54% . The only thing missing is an ocean. So we go on cruises out of Houston or Florida for our fix!

    Either location, the secret is to actually be in a spot to enjoy the area. Working 9-5 that is quite difficult to do. You have escaped that madness and are enjoying the benefits now.

  122. Bryan,

    Thanks so much. Yeah, I do quite enjoy being able to forgo a coat for 99% of the time. I can’t remember the last time I was “cold” down here. Rarely happens unless I’m up early on a cold morning.

    That state income tax isn’t bad at all. I’d certainly prefer 0%, but that rate isn’t bad.

    Definitely agree that, bottom line, the key is to be happy where you’re at. If you’re not happy where you’re at, figure out how to get to where you would be happy. I’ll sometimes run across forum boards when I’m researching areas and I’ll read all these complaints about cities/states/localities by people who live there. And it never ceases to amaze me. The US is so great in that you have this opportunity to move to pretty much anywhere without having to jump through visa/residency/immigration hoops like you’d have to in other countries. You can literally get mountains or beaches… cities or country… cold or warm. Be where you’re happiest. 🙂

    Thanks for dropping by!

    Best wishes.

  123. Hi, just my 2 cents here. I live in WA state. We pay no state income tax. Our property taxes are pretty reasonable. I live closer to Seattle but here is a secret for you. Move to WA state on the border with OR. WA has no state income tax, and OR has no sales tax. I hear people down that way love it. We are taxed heavily in other ways but hey….can’t beat no state tax and no sales tax. 🙂

  124. Trish,

    Thanks for dropping by!

    Yeah, the Vancouver, WA idea has been brought up a few times now. I think that would only really work if you’re interested in actually living in Vancouver. Just my take on it. Seems like more of a bedroom community. And not a real fast way to get to Portland without a car. If you’re really interested in the Portland lifestyle, it would make the most sense just to live in Portland. Otherwise, it devolves into living in any suburb outside of a major city, which is a totally different lifestyle with its own pros and cons.

    No state income tax and sales tax is nice, but you’d then have to account for transportation costs. I have no car, pay no state income tax, and rarely have to pay much in sales tax. Living up in Vancouver means you either own a car, or are taking expensive train/lengthy bus trips to Portland.

    Cheers!

  125. I definitely miss the weather in California, but that’s it. Everything else that goes on there is enough to keep me out of the state.

    For Washington, Bellingham is on my short list. It’s not in the sky-high CoL Seattle area, but it’s still not as cheap as most Florida cities. I looked at apartments through walkscore and there are some decent one bedroom apartments for ~$700/mo in highly walkable areas (I’d really like to be vehicle-free soon). There seem to be quite a few MMM forum members up in that area, lots of outdoor activities (good river and ocean fishing!), a university, etc.

    Hopefully by this time next year I will have sold my house and started roaming around the country!

    Take Care!

  126. I live in Boise, Idaho, which, as you mentioned the other day on my blog, is a gem of a city that many people don’t know about. It has a lot of great things going for it, and I really love living here. Always been a fan of the topography and landscape of the Pacific Northwest.

    Florida does seem like heaven on Earth, though. Warm weather year-round, world-class beaches, low COL, and no state income tax. Man, that’s the dream right there! The only thing I really wouldn’t look forward to is the summer humidity. I hate humidity with a seething passion, I think living NYC my whole life may have traumatized me in that regard 😛

    At the end of the day though, I would pick humidity over a 7.4% state income tax. Eff that. Perhaps I’ll come be your neighbor in Sarasota in a decade or so once I (hopefully) reach FI! 😉

    Cheers bro

  127. Alex,

    Thanks for stopping in!

    Yeah, I think Boise is a great city. It’s not discussed much, which I think bodes well for you guys. The less others know about it, the better for those living there. Great downtown, pretty moderate weather, a COL that isn’t too crazy, clean, low crime, etc. I think the only knocks are the high income tax and inability to really thrive without a car out that way. I’ve read of some firsthand accounts of people who live(d) out that way without a car and it seems a bit challenging. Otherwise, super high quality of life, from what I can see. I’m sure you’d concur. 🙂

    The humidity is definitely high here in the summer. Not too much different in terms of overall feel from the summers we’d get up north, though, and I think the mid-Atlantic area experiences similar/higher humidity in the summer. But definitely higher than where you’re at. We get no snow/cold, though. Always trade-offs.

    If you ever make it this way for a vacation, let me know. It’d be great to meet up!

    Best wishes.

  128. Wohhhh…Florida is just a dream for me. Sun, beaches, weather…mmm, definitely a paradise.
    Here in Spain we’ve got Canary Island which is fantastic place but taxes are 20% in dividend. Awful!
    Is it possible to live in Florida if you come from Spain as a investor?

    Cheers from the north of Spain full of rain!

  129. Javier,

    I’m with you, bud. It’s a veritable paradise for me, too. I’m so fortunate to live here. We’re lucky here in the US to have something like this available on the mainland. And it’s affordable to boot. 🙂

    Couldn’t really say how immigration would work out for you. That’s beyond me. But the Canary Islands are beautiful. Not doing too bad over there.

    Thanks for dropping by. Hope all is well in Spain!

    Best regards.

  130. You should spend a year in Tallahassee before you call FL weather wonderful. Summers in the 90-100s with 80% humidity. Winders regularly below freezing, but you’re never rewarded with snow. And I worked outdoors for 3 years at a tire shop, so I got to experience everything first hand there. I grew up in South Florida, but pretty inland from the coast, bordering the Everglades so we didn’t have any cooling breeze from the coast.

  131. Ken,

    Like I mentioned, I was specifically speaking about the Tampa Bay area in the article. I used that as a proxy for the state, but it doesn’t necessarily match up on everything across the board. Much of Florida has pretty nice weather, but I find that it’s far better along the coasts. It’s moderated a bit and you get that nice breeze. I would have never moved to Tallahassee because it’s hotter in the summer and cooler in the winter than other areas of the state. Plus, there’s not much to really like up that way for me. You guys do get a little bit of fall up there, though, which is nice.

    But I think this area of the state works well as a proxy because most of the population of Florida lives near the coastline. Like every state, there are better areas than others. Tallahassee seems like one of the inferior options.

    Thanks for stopping by!

    Cheers.

  132. Sorry, I must’ve glanced over the Tampa part 🙂

    Yes, I definitely agree that Tally is not a great place to live. I went to school there and got out ASAP. First to NC (which we loved) and then to Denver for snowboarding (which we don’t even do anymore). I haven’t spent any meaningful time close to the water in FL though, so you may be right on all points. My brother lives in Melbourne and calls it death’s waiting room, but I think his area per capita is one of the oldest in the state.

    COL in Denver is high, much higher than FL. Real estate and rentals have really exploded, plus we have income tax as well as local taxes around 6-9% depending on area. I may consider returning to FL (or another no income tax state) once I no longer am dependent on a large metro area for my job.

  133. I envy your style and strategy. When life handed you lemons (Detroit 2009), you made lemonade.
    It takes a certain degree of bravery to uproot and transplant to the unknown–alone. It doesn’t matter where you went (though the benefits listed here, of why you chose FL, are enticing)—it’s really about the fact that you did it at all. Very admirable.

  134. divy,

    Ha! Thanks so much for that. Appreciate the support.

    Yeah, some people thought I was crazy back in 2009. I found a room for rent from craiglist and moved in sight unseen. My family can be pretty conservative, so they thought that was nuts. They just thought it was this huge risk. But I thought it was too big of a risk not to go. I put a plan together and figured I couldn’t miss down here. The headwinds up in Michigan trying to do what I thought I could do were too strong. It’s been so much easier down here, which is why I thought it was time to give Florida its due. 🙂

    It’s the same thing with trying to achieve financial independence. The risk is in not saving and investing, not the other way around. Maybe I just view risk differently than most. I don’t know. But I truly believe in that old saying that life is 10% what happens to you and 90% how you react. So I long ago decided to generally react to events (positive or negative) in a way that puts me in the best possible position to succeed and make my dreams come true. This move back in 2009 was just another example of that.

    Stay in touch. Hope all is well!

    Best wishes.

  135. Jason,
    I don’t know if Florida is the best place to achieve early retirement but you sure make it look like it :).

    I love beaches and I would certainly try to figure out a way to write on the beach if I were there.

    I live in Quebec and our winters are even worse than the ones you had in Michigan… oh god I hate winter! I would love to live in Florida!

    But I was born here and … I’m attached to that place. I’m a french speaker and my girlfriend doesn’t even speak english, plus we’ll soon have a kid and we will need help from our families while he’ll be young so I guess I’ll have to reach FI here in Quebec…

    But once retired, I wouldn’t mind to come spend a couple of months a year (the cold ones) in Florida like many Quebeckers are doing every year. Here we call them snow birds! 😉 I’d love to be a snowbird too!

    Take care

  136. Hey Jason,

    Florida really sounds like paradise on Earth! Like you said, there’s normally a trade-off between quality of life and high expenses, yet Florida seems heavily tipped towards the “best of both worlds” side.

    Hailing from Barcelona – Spain myself, I know what good weather and a high quality of life mean. It’s not even that expensive compared to other main European cities, so I see it as a very plausible place to retire -very early of course!

    Cheers

    Dividend Legion

  137. I’m very jealous of you Jason! I also live in a very beautiful part of the world – Nova Scotia – but the taxes here are something else! We’re looking at 15% income tax (+ federal) + 15% sales tax – that’s a lot! Luckily the high sales tax helps me reduce my expenses even more – I don’t want to be paying that. Unlike the States, we don’t have much opportunity to move to lower tax rate jurisdictions – Alberta is really my only option. However, I love being by the water too much – like you! Great blog post as always.

  138. Avoiding state income tax would be nice. I would consider moving in a few years to save the taxes I pay in California. It was 106 here yesterday, so I am used to the heat (only moving to Phoenix would seem like a way to have hotter summers). I really like the mild winters here, but SW Florida would be even better.

    I would also consider staying for the social and family network. Having help with the kids, projects, etc has some value, just not sure how to calculate it. You could figure out the cost of free babysitting and some other things, but part of it is just a comfort level.

  139. Allan,

    I can only imagine what the winters are like up your way. But I can also understand the pull of family and everything. The pull of family kept me in Michigan longer than I ever wanted to be, and even pulled me back up there for a short period of time last year. But, ultimately, I have to be where I’m happiest. Just one of those things. And Florida is tough to beat, in my view. 🙂

    But you become more free and flexible every single day. Imagine being a 35-year-old snowbird. How about that? Able to travel south for the winter while everyone else is freezing. That’s true freedom right there!

    Thanks for dropping by.

    Best regards.

  140. DL,

    Indeed. That was my overarching point. The quality of life is high while taxes and COL is simultaneously relatively low. It’s really a unique place in the US from that standpoint. I think Texas makes a case for that. The Midwest also has a number of cities that are very affordable, but you definitely don’t have the favorable weather there.

    Barcelona looks really beautiful. It’s great to seek out and achieve financial independence with so much beauty around you. It inspires you. And it gives you plenty to do once you have all that time on your hands. 🙂

    Best regards!

  141. Iain,

    Ouch. Those taxes are pretty brutal. But you’re definitely right in that it gives you even more motivation to become creative and consume less. Always have to find a bright side. 🙂

    I’m sure that’s a beautiful part of the world as well, in its own way. Never been up there.

    Thanks for dropping by!

    Best wishes.

  142. Vawt,

    The family aspect keeps a lot of people in place. Sometimes that’s great. Sometimes not. For me, I felt like it was a gravitational pull, keeping me somewhere I didn’t really want to be. But other people don’t find their happiness levels changing much with the weather/geographical location. Just one of those things that each person has to figure out for themselves. If you’re quite happy where you’re at and you have that family/social network in place, then it’s probably just best to stay where you’re at. I can imagine for some people that even an idyllic paradise would be a bad place to live if they had to give up a huge network. I, however, have a small family and only a couple close friends.

    Although, if a move is ever in the cards, Florida offers a lot to like. If I knew of a better place on the whole, I’d have moved there. 🙂

    Best regards.

  143. Nice writeup. Something else to consider, later on at least–FL is tied to a lot of the NY infrastructure, tax structure, etc. For example, the post-retirement healthcare I would qualify for as a NY State employee works in four states: NY, CT, NJ, and FL. Domicile elsewhere and the benefit is lost. NY taxes mandatory pension contributions upfront in the expectation you’ll move to FL later, so distributions are tax-free in NY and FL–not necessarily so in other states, which might tax them again.

    We ended up in upstate NY for all qualitative reasons, though the quantitative part is not great. Things did improve over NYC–our savings rate increased about 15% & housing cost decreased 40%, despite my taking a 20% cut to salary, but relative to other places the tax burden is massive. My savings rate is around ~60% now, which to me is acceptable all things considered.

    I like the area more than anywhere else I’ve lived and it has most of what we want–and if we waited until we were in early retirement to move here, I don’t know if we’d be able to afford it.

    It means a lot to me that I can go birdwatching before work and xc skiing woods or swimming in a waterfall 10 minutes after shift ends instead of having to wait for the weekend to go somewhere. If I do have to work for 10 years or 15 or whatever, it may as well be somewhere where the off-work hours are as enjoyable as possible–which seems to have been your view on seaside living also. And I love the cold; we are actually much more happy and active in winter, at least until <10F, but never leave the house in summer when it's over 80. The only bad parts about winter are the short days and everyone else's complaining!

  144. Hi Jason,
    I agree that FL is a great place to retire. I haven’t checked the West Coast but if we were to stay living in the U.S. we’d consider FL. We’re thinking about moving abroad, first to the Caribbean (maybe do one continent per decade) after we’re ready to retire early.

  145. Great article and I agree totally. Ive spent my whole life in kentucky, and can say one of my biggest reasons for wanting to retire early is that I hate winter. I spend half the year in a place that I hate, I usually go to Florida a couple times per winter, which lately has only made my dislike for winter even worse. Oh well, one day I will retire there ” hopefully in Lake Placid “, until then I’ll keep investing and dreaming. Thanks for the great read as always.

  146. Jana,

    I wasn’t aware that New York and Florida worked so closely like that. Definitely an interesting scenario if you’re retiring/moving here from NY.

    Glad you found your own little paradise up there. I’d be one of those complainers during the wintertime, so it’s better that I’m down here. 🙂

    Thanks for sharing. Glad you guys make the most of the weather up there. IF you’re going to live somewhere where it’s cold/snowy for a good chunk of the year, you’ve gotta embrace it.

    Cheers!

  147. Mr. Enchumbao,

    One continent per decade sounds pretty sweet. I quite like the idea of slow travel where one lives in a new country/city/state for a few years or even a decade before trying something else out. Speaks to my view on living new “lifetimes”. 🙂

    Best of luck finding that which works best for you guys when the time comes.

    Take care.

  148. Larry,

    Thanks so much. Glad you enjoyed it! 🙂

    I know EXACTLY how you feel about spending your life in a place with miserable weather for half the year. I just decided a long time ago that’s no way to live. Half the year is half our life if we never move somewhere that’s more in line with what we want and that which makes us happy.

    Best of luck finding your way to Lake Placid. I’ll keep investing and dreaming alongside you.

    Cheers.

  149. Yeah I’d love to. I’ve set my date at 45 in 2026… but the more I’m investing and evolving into this journey, the more I understand the value of time. So yesterday, I made new projections and I’ve been able to reduce my goal by two years with slight modifications. In 2020 my mortgage will be paid so I should be able to inject another 14,000$ a year into my dream… I factored that in and realized I could quit the rat race two years earlier and achieve the same results. Plus, I never factored in my projections the fact that I will invest 100% of my online income into my freedom fund too… and I might also take the time pretty soon to make a real budget like you do to see if I couldn’t cut some fat to invest even more.

    That would be great to reach FI at 40-42 instead of 45. I just turned 34… but I doubt it will be feasible. Anyhow, every years and months count! So I’ll do my best and will come and say hi at Siesta Key when I’ll reach my goal!

    Take care buddy

  150. Hi; LOVED the article. Very Timely for me. I am hoping to retire after 26 1/2 years of being a Librarian in an Elementary School in N.C. I got a part time job at Disney that starts next week. It has always been my DREAM to work there.
    I have a QUESTION for you. We will be relocating to the Orlando area somewhere that is affordable and safe. Tampa is a bit too far for us. Do you have any suggestions on places where there is about an acre of land and is a safe area? I have talked to realtors, apartment hunters, etc. You seem like the BEST source about Florida.
    Any advice you give me would be appreciated. I am staying at a hotel til I figure out where to move.
    I will be losing $15,000 a year in retirement by retiring early but I am totally burned out; teachers are treated awful in NC and I’m ready to GO.
    Thank you so much!
    Lenore
    Burlington, NC

  151. Lenore,

    First, I’m so glad that you’re considering health, time, happiness and overall quality of life over money. Time is our most valuable and precious commodity, and it’s slowly dwindling away. The time to be happy and do what you want is today! 🙂

    Unfortunately, however, I cannot help you with your question. I know Orlando very little. I’ve been there sparingly and it was straight in and out of Disney. Wish I could help more, but I just don’t know the area very well. I would maybe check with a real estate forum or something where you can check with some locals. City-data is pretty solid. And Zillow allows you to ask local realtors/experts, too.

    Best of luck with your move!!

    Take care.

  152. Florida seems gorgeous. I think it’s a beautiful state. It sounds like you’ve found paradise.

  153. Lila,

    I’m really fortunate. Florida is indeed beautiful. Of course, there are many beautiful places here in the US. I just think Florida has certain inherent advantages that are built in for people aiming for this kind of lifestyle. Not sure I’ll always live here; I’d like to see many areas. But if I were to move, I’d do so knowing that I was leaving behind perhaps the best place to pursue this goal.

    Thanks for stopping by!

    Best regards.

  154. Yes, my rent is 4 times what yours is! Can’t wait to get out of DC area in retirement! Geesh! We keep all other expenses super low- probably 30k total for everything else. If we could get a 12 K a year rent we could get by quite easily on 45 k. Right now we need almost 70 k for all expenses including rent.

  155. DD,

    I hear D.C. is a really great, but expensive, city. But I suppose it’s necessary to live there considering your occupation. The good news is that those dividend dollars stack all the same in D.C. as anywhere else, giving you the opportunity to commit some geographical arbitrage down the road. 🙂

    Cheers!

  156. You have made me change my perception about Florida. Since I’m about to retire, I think I will move to Florida and enjoy the sun and the fact that no income tax has to burden me again. I hope that the cost of living will enable me to enjoy my log time hobby of admiring mother nature.

  157. Chella,

    Hey, that’s fantastic. Best of luck if you do decide to move to Florida. I wouldn’t hold Florida in such high regard and live here if I really thought there were a superior place to seek out and achieve early retirement. There might be better places to live on the whole, but Florida’s pretty tough to beat when it comes to this specific lifestyle.

    Cheers!

  158. Hi, Jason…thought I’d chime in on the move from Michigan. We also moved from around Pontiac in 2009 but we picked Arizona. People usually reference Phoenix regarding the weather but most of the state is mountainous. We’re at a mile high, and as I write this the temp is a breezy 75, no humidity. I have a beautiful view of flagstaff about 90 miles away. And a forest fire. And a mountain lion. Like you said: pros and cons everywhere. Congratulations on your milestone and keep up the good work. You’re quite an inspiration.

  159. Russ,

    Thanks for adding that!

    Great point about Arizona. It’s a very diverse state in terms of climate and topography. I was really surprised when I read about Flagstaff’s weather. Over 100 inches of snow a year and an average annual low temp that sits below freezing. Way too cold for me, but it does look beautiful out that way. And you guys get a lot of sun out that way, which is really nice. 🙂

    Appreciate the support. We all have to find out own little paradise out there.

    Best regards!

  160. My husband has a place in Fort Myers. He wants to live there, but it is on a golf course and not at all walkable or suitable to be car free (which I am for two years now). I would love to live down there, but closer to the beach or at least the downtown area where the buses run. I just moved back to the midwest and I am NOT looking forward to a car-free winter! 🙂

  161. I grew up in Jax. FL…it’s the one state in the USA no one should ever starve in. If u do it means u were too lazy to throw a hook and line in the water…or too lazy to pick some fruit…when I was a kid we had orange trees and pecan trees in our yard…and in the woods…cold winters killed the orange trees but everything else is still there…people don’t know this much but oranges used to grow in Savannah during colonial times…now they only grow in S Fl…how’s that for evidence of global cooling lol?
    Florida has tons of dairy and cattle farms too…it isn’t just beaches and tourism either…anyone wishing to retire there just follow one piece of advice: avoid the bigger cities. Find a nice small town an hour away and count your blessings.

  162. Dave,

    Thanks for sharing your experience!

    I agree that finding some small town somewhere might make more economical sense, depending on a variety of factors. I personally prefer cities by a large margin, so I just have to always financially plan for that lifestyle.

    Take care.

  163. Jason, given your lifestyle you should totally get what you need to work at the beach!

    Sure it might cost a bit to buy whatever internet service is required to support it, but being able to work absolutely anywhere when you live in such a beautiful state would be worth it I think. Plus, it might save you buying a courtesy drink when you go to a cafe to use their wifi:)

  164. Dallas is great too, despite it’s reputation. If you live in Dallas proper it’s very progressive – now the suburbs of Dallas is a different matter, they are very conservative.

  165. steveak,

    Ha! Wouldn’t that be something. Literally working at the beach. That’s the stuff you see on magazine covers. 🙂

    It’s something I might consider when the weather cools a bit. I’d have to really slather on the sunscreen out there, though. Money-wise, it would probably work out similar. I’d have to take the bus to/from the beach, which adds up. And I’d have to buy the wireless access. But it sure would be fun to go out there once in a while.

    Thanks for stopping by!

    Best regards.

  166. steveak,

    Thanks for sharing that.

    Dallas is an interesting pick. Never been there, but seems pretty vibrant to me. I know of someone who spent some time out in the DFW Metroplex. They advised me it was a pretty massive area. If you could live right in the downtown area and get by without a car, though, that would be pretty sweet.

    I’m surprised to hear about the progressive part. My impression was that it’s firmly within the “Bible Belt”. But, again, I’ve never been there. Would definitely be a nice city to check out.

    Cheers!

  167. Mike,

    As much as I love the beach if I ever move to a coastal location I’ll definitely be renting not buying for exactly that reason.

    Even if the property you buy stays safely dry for 75 years, once the general public accepts sea levels are rising anyone selling beachfront land will see their property values plummet!

  168. Joel, google 72t SEPP.

    There are ways to access some of your tax deferred retirement accounts without penalty even if you retire early

  169. By the way, I was just in Florida (Fort Lauderdale) and read this article again, and you are SO right! …we were like, “dude, this is the dividend mantra’s state!!! he is not far from us!” LOL! Thanks for the article, I will probably spend a few years of my life in Florida now… I just need to finish my work in a few other states first, but as I grow as an investor, I can certainly see Florida as a possibility in the future!

  170. JC,

    Ha! Yeah, I’m always happy to meet up with people. So if you ever find yourself over on this side of the state, let me know. 🙂

    There are certainly many wonderful places to call home. I’m not even saying Florida is the best. I do, however, think the pros far outweigh the cons here. And I think living here is conducive to succeeding in this lifestyle.

    Like I mentioned in the article and some comments, I’d love to live somewhere like downtown Portland or somewhere similar. A very urban environment that allows for a rich and robust lifestyle. But would that lifestyle necessarily be congruent with what I’m trying to achieve now? Probably not so much. But there’s always a chance down the line that I try somewhere new. Just like I’d love to live multiple lifetimes, I think it might make sense to also check out multiple types of geographies throughout my life. Sort of like slow travel, but really slow it down.

    Still, though, I’d have a hard time leaving. I know deep down inside that this place is truly optimal for this lifestyle.

    I think you’d love it here. Low taxes, great weather, plenty of sunshine. Certainly worse places in the world to call home.

    Best regards.

  171. Having been through many, hurricanes usually aren’t a big deal. For most storms the big risk is flooding and you can actually prepare yourself for it, and run from it, particularly if you don’t have to work a shift before evacuating.

    Tampa/St.Pete/CLW is a disaster waiting to happen in terms of a hurricane– it’s a long discussion as to why, but part of the reason is that it hasn’t been hit hard in a long time.

  172. I grew up in FL, in the tampa area. I still live in Fl, but not in that area any longer. As a young man I noticed people living a low cost beach loving lifestyle– people who lived a few blocks off the beach, in low cost places, who rode bikes around the beach areas, and worked seemingly few hours at relatively low stress jobs, if at all.

    Here’s a few other points about florida:

    The property taxes aspect can be mitigated quite a bit by choosing a property of a certain value, since you get a $50,000 homestead exemption. In simplest terms, if you chose a place with a tax value of around $75k, you’ll probably pay very little in property taxes. You don’t get the same property tax benefit with renting, because the exemption cannot be applied to a rental, thus the taxes are in your rent unless your landlord is taking a loss, which does happen sometimes (obviously you get other benefits when renting too, but that’s not the point).

    You might think that you can’t buy a place near the beach for that low of a tax value, but you’d be wrong. You can, you just have to know where to look. Property values a few blocks off of the beach are usually quite reasonable. Also, bus lines that go directly out to the beach sometimes go through pleasant low cost areas that are just inland.

    There are areas that have an almost constant breeze, usually due to proximity to bodies of water. Even in August at the hottest part of the day, if you are in the shade, and in the breeze, and not actively working (sitting and reading for example)– being outside is quite tolerable. As someone who did active daytime work outdoors for 2 years in Florida summers, you also get strangely used to the heat.

  173. Mo,

    That’s just one more reason to become financially independent. If there are good odds that a hurricane is on a direct path for wherever you’re living (Tampa or otherwise), then it makes sense to just get out of Dodge at that point. It’s not like a hurricane sneaks up on you. So you’d have time to get out of the area and continue on like it’s no big deal.

    That’s also a good reason to rent. And a good reason to not live on the ground floor. And also a good reason to not own a bunch of stuff. All works in tandem. 🙂

    Cheers!

  174. Mo,

    Thanks for adding that!

    I agree with you on affordable property near the water. All depends on what you want and what kind of lifestyle you’re after. I haven’t looked in some time now, but I do remember fairly affordable property being located not far off from beaches in many smaller Gulf Coast towns. They’d be smaller properties and older, but, again, it’s a lifestyle thing.

    I’ve adjusted to the heat fairly well. It doesn’t really bother me unless we’re walking to/from the grocery store in the sun on our weekly run. We go pretty late in the day, but it’s still hot. And the grocery store is something like 3/4 of a mile away. And you’re pushing a cart and carrying bags. So we definitely sweat on that walk. But, like I mentioned in the article, it’s hot in a lot of places in the summer. Whether you’re in Tampa or Chicago, it’s likely to be pretty warm in July. So you just have to be smart about that.

    Best regards!

  175. Plus you guys have Publix, easily the biggest thing we miss since leaving Florida. We used to get their hot wings once a month. They’re huge, and a 20-pc box is only $8.99. We’d only eat 4 each, so it would be good for at least 2 meals.

  176. Ken,

    Good call there. I’ve had their wings before. Not bad at all. Their fried chicken is also pretty solid.

    I think what they do really well is their subs. Not the cheapest sandwich in the world, but they’re really good. 🙂

    Cheers!

  177. Grew up outside of Detroit. It’s really sad what has happened to the city. Moved to Baltimore because there were no teaching jobs in Michigan. Love your work.

  178. Nate,

    Thanks so much. Glad you’re enjoying the blog. 🙂

    I agree. It’s a shame what’s happened there in Detroit. I don’t envy the jobs of those that are in charge of cleaning things up. Wouldn’t even know where to start. I can only say that I’m glad I no longer live there. I truly and honestly believe I might not be alive if I never would have made it out.

    Never been to Baltimore, but I hope you’re enjoying yourself out there.

    Cheers!

  179. Great post! I live about halfway between Orlando and Tampa and I was worried that all the tourism would get on my nerves. Yet I ended up loving it and still do!

    Your first point brought to mind a very distinct memory of mine – last year a friend of mine visited and we spent the day with her grandparents who are retired and living in the Anna Maria Island area (my favorite of all the beaches I’ve visited here so far). I remember noticing how happy they were, yet also feeling this pang of “I do NOT want to be traditional in the sense that I wait until their age to finally start living my life.” It’s a feeling that stuck with me and motivated me to get serious about paying off my debt and saving more aggressively.

    My journey looks a bit different than yours – I don’t want to retire early, necessarily – yet I do want to give myself the freedom of choice. I’ve reduced my lifestyle and spend money mainly on experiences, not useless stuff. I also contribute towards a Roth IRA, will have all my debt 100% paid off by September, and have a healthy e-fund. My goal is to build up the e-fund a bit more and then redesign my career around the things I enjoy, like photography/writing.

    It’s funny, paying off my debt and saving so aggressively has actually made it very clear to me what matters in my life. And none of it is stuff. It’s time with family and friends, traveling and seeing the world, and being creative through my photography and writing. Lucky for me, all of those things can be done locally here in FL – we live in a fantastic state to explore!

    Thanks for sharing this post, as a fellow Floridian I agree with 100% of what you’ve stated here! I’ve never been as happy living anywhere else as I am here in the sunshine state. 🙂

  180. Stephanie,

    Thanks so much for sharing that. Really appreciate it.

    I know exactly how you feel when you state that you don’t want to wait until old age to really enjoy the finer things in life. And when I say “finer things”, I mean that which really matters most: time with people you care about, the ability to wake up and do what you really love, being able to travel at will, and pursuing your passions.

    Why wait until you’re old to soak up the sunshine, warm weather, and beautiful beaches?

    Glad you’re on the right track to make your dreams come true. Life is too short to not pursue your dreams. 🙂

    Cheers!

  181. I agree with you 100%

    Tony Robbins wrote about this topic in his latest book. I don’t agree with many of the topics in the book, but Tony moving his family and business from California to Florida was a very intelligent move.

    I went to college in Nevada and lived there for 10 years after school. Nevada has no state tax, and no state tax is a blessing for sure. I didn’t appreciate it it then, but fast forward 15-years; last year I paid $10K in California state taxes! This is a huge amount. Uncle Sam knocked me over and California kicked me while I was down.

  182. DD,

    That’s interesting there about Robbins. I just read an article where he specifically referenced state income taxes as the impetus behind the move. Great minds think alike. 🙂

    California seems like an amazing and beautiful place. But I just couldn’t live there with that kind of tax burden. I mentioned a few times that I secretly dream of living out in Portland. The urban planning out there is something right out of Northern Europe. Living somewhere dynamic and dense where walkability thrives would be great, but it’s just not in the cards right now. And I know in my heart that Florida is just so superior when it comes to this lifestyle. Besides, it’s a veritable paradise down here with the weather and scenery. Truly beautiful in so many ways.

    Sorry to hear about California kicking you while you’re down. I didn’t even like Michigan’s 4.35% tax, so I couldn’t imagine the kind of check I’d have to write California. But I guess that’s the price of living in your own little paradise over there. 🙂

    Cheers!

  183. Love your articles, long time follower of your blog! Moving this week from Cleveland to Tampa area.

  184. Zoltan,

    Excellent choice. I can’t imagine you’ll regret that on an objective level. Might be difficult to live in a new place, especially if you have attachments in Ohio. But it’s a great move on paper. 🙂

    Appreciate the support very much. Best of luck with the move and enjoy your new time in Tampa!

    Cheers.

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